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Bolex Thread (or Mechanism?!) Help, URGENT fir film shoot, Video Included


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#1 Stephen Ciavardini

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 02:13 AM

In the link to my video below, you can see I'm having trouble with the Film keeping its loop when I open the loop gate arms. Working on a Bolex H16 Please help, pm, chat whatever! I'm ON all night. Any help would be much appreciated. Thanks!


Edited by Stephen Ciavardini, 17 March 2011 - 02:13 AM.

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#2 Roberto Pirodda

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 03:05 AM

In the link to my video below, you can see I'm having trouble with the Film keeping its loop when I open the loop gate arms. Working on a Bolex H16 Please help, pm, chat whatever! I'm ON all night. Any help would be much appreciated. Thanks!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=szP3uSw7tCw



by your ( not clear) video it appears that pull down claw isn't hooking the perforations
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#3 Ian Cooper

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 03:10 AM

Is the pull-down claw engaging with the film Ok?
Is the claw even there, or has it broken off?!

The fact that the film is being pulled taut at the bottom, whilst at the top it is being bunched up into the loop former, would seem to suggest there's nothing actively moving it through the gate - instead it's relying on the takeup side to drag it through?

The pulldown claw should pull the film through the gate one perf at a time. At the same rate the top sprocket should feed one extra perf of film into the top loop, whilst the bottom sprocket pulls one perf of film out of the bottom loop - everything remaining in balance and the same size in the process.


EDIT: Whoops, seems both Roberto and I were typing the same thing at the same time!

Edited by Ian Cooper, 17 March 2011 - 03:12 AM.

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#4 Chris Millar

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 03:54 AM

We need to see whats going on with the pressure pad removed ...

Also try hand cranking it with out any film in and filming that for us to look at also ;)
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#5 Stephen Ciavardini

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 05:50 AM

Hey all,

Thanks for the quick reply and the feedback. I reshot the first video, and one as requested without the pressure plate. Bolex H16 Reflex yr 1956-57.

Recap


Running the Bolex without the pressure plate

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#6 Stephen Ciavardini

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 05:53 AM

by your ( not clear) video it appears that pull down claw isn't hooking the perforations



Is the pull-down claw engaging with the film Ok?
Is the claw even there, or has it broken off?!

The fact that the film is being pulled taut at the bottom, whilst at the top it is being bunched up into the loop former, would seem to suggest there's nothing actively moving it through the gate - instead it's relying on the takeup side to drag it through?

The pulldown claw should pull the film through the gate one perf at a time. At the same rate the top sprocket should feed one extra perf of film into the top loop, whilst the bottom sprocket pulls one perf of film out of the bottom loop - everything remaining in balance and the same size in the process.


EDIT: Whoops, seems both Roberto and I were typing the same thing at the same time!



We need to see whats going on with the pressure pad removed ...

Also try hand cranking it with out any film in and filming that for us to look at also ;)



In addition to the new post above with the clearer recap and no pressure plate video, I have included what could be the possible problem with the Bolex (or nothing is wrong and that is the way these were built :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzP3LWLgalc
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#7 Dom Jaeger

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 06:41 AM

It's a little hard to see exactly, but the claw looks a bit odd. I'm wondering if perhaps the front plate was removed at some point and the two claws (forward and reverse) were mixed up and positioned incorrectly when the front was refitted.

Looking from above with the turret forward, the longer claw should be to the left and the smaller reverse claw to the right. They both attach at the same pivot.

With a very small screwdriver you can undo the two screws holding the plate that covers the claw pivot, remove the plate and have a closer look.
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#8 Jean-Louis Seguin

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 08:03 AM

It appears to me your trying to load 16mm film into a 8mm camera. That's your problem.

Cheers,
Jean-Louis
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#9 Chris Millar

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Posted 17 March 2011 - 11:43 PM

It appears to me your trying to load 16mm film into a 8mm camera. That's your problem.

Cheers,
Jean-Louis


ah ha ha ha ha !

Oh dear, yes I see now...

Aside from the obvious 'fault' (the claw might be pulling down at the right rate but its only pulling half of what it needs to) how else can you tell it is double8 just from looking at the insides ? The claw ? More sprockets ? I didn't spot them with the video quality as it is...

If it was a 16mm camera after all I was going to suggest a top and bottom sprocket mistiming - but one would have to be loose, and you'd spot that probably.
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#10 Jean-Louis Seguin

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Posted 18 March 2011 - 07:18 AM

ah ha ha ha ha !

Oh dear, yes I see now...

Aside from the obvious 'fault' (the claw might be pulling down at the right rate but its only pulling half of what it needs to) how else can you tell it is double8 just from looking at the insides ? The claw ? More sprockets ? I didn't spot them with the video quality as it is...

If it was a 16mm camera after all I was going to suggest a top and bottom sprocket mistiming - but one would have to be loose, and you'd spot that probably.





Some clues: very small D-mount lenses; very thin front plate; chrome-plated spill-over lever thingies only found on H8s; no loop restorer; etc...

Cheers,
Jean-Louis
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#11 Simon Wyss

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Posted 20 March 2011 - 09:28 AM

You are in urgent need of clarity and calm. Sorry, no offense intention, it is what I experience watching your videos. Pictures so shaky and out of focus I can hardly follow. Sound dropping out now and then I cannot hear what you say. But it is a very simple thing to answer the question: You have an H 8 loaded with 16-mm. film. That cannot function. I can instantly tell by the spool axles which are round with the 8-mm. film Paillard-Bolex cameras and square with the sixteeners. Attempt to prevent exactly what happened. I know, Double-8 film is nowadays sold on wrong spools. SIC TRANSIT GLORIA MUNDI.

What I find good is that you make a video, set it on display, and ask.
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