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4k HMI Goya vs Arri 4k HMI


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#1 Nadeem Soumah

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Posted 30 May 2011 - 02:37 PM

Would a Goya 4k HMI have the same britness as a standard 4k HMI?

I was looking for a 4k HMI par to use as a backlight on a night street scenes (very wide shot) and the production company is offering me a 4k goya as an option. Will this give me the same as a 4k HMI par or even fresnel?

Also is this light suitable to use as a backlight for a night street scene?

Thanks.
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#2 Jaron Berman

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Posted 30 May 2011 - 02:47 PM

no, not even close, BUT the goya is a cool light for a different reason - it throws a very flat and even beam of a very wide angle so you can cover a large area with the light closer - the only disadvantage to this is your inverse square law - when people/objects move closer and farther they will get brighter and darker moreso than a more focused unit farther away - like a 4k par. One very cool thing about the goya is the availability of a "black reflector" which means you can throw one, razor-sharp shadow from the unit - even a flooded fresnel can't touch the clean edge of that beam. In general though, if you need "punch" then a par will give you more bang for your buck. I've used the goya as a nighttime "backlight" but mostly because the character was going to be in profile at one point and relatively close to a wall - and i wanted that cartoonishly defined shadow.
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#3 Nadeem Soumah

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Posted 30 May 2011 - 03:29 PM

no, not even close, BUT the goya is a cool light for a different reason - it throws a very flat and even beam of a very wide angle so you can cover a large area with the light closer - the only disadvantage to this is your inverse square law - when people/objects move closer and farther they will get brighter and darker moreso than a more focused unit farther away - like a 4k par. One very cool thing about the goya is the availability of a "black reflector" which means you can throw one, razor-sharp shadow from the unit - even a flooded fresnel can't touch the clean edge of that beam. In general though, if you need "punch" then a par will give you more bang for your buck. I've used the goya as a nighttime "backlight" but mostly because the character was going to be in profile at one point and relatively close to a wall - and i wanted that cartoonishly defined shadow.


Thanks so much. My options are basically between the Goya and a 1200 HMI PAR, so no 4K like requested.

Shooting on RED MX and really concerned about exposure here. I don't think the 1.2 will cut it and apparently not the 4k Goya. I'll still take the Goya regardless as it seems it may be fun to work with and create some really cool stuff considering the black reflector.

Do you think the 1200HMI par will provide more punch from a far distance than the GOya will however?
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#4 Jaron Berman

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Posted 30 May 2011 - 09:08 PM

depending on which lens you use the 1200 will likely have more throw. The Goya is very similar to the Arri X-lite (arri copied to my knowledge), so if you can find the arri online calculator you should be able to punch in distances of both fixtures and see relative spreads, stops, fc etc - basically just think of the goya/x as a big BIG lightbulb - that's all it is.

50' away, the 1200 par with a flood lens at middle focus position should give a beam 46' across (+ field) at key on a RED shooting f/2.8 (basically needs 45FC). The X-lite should be able to throw the same lumens but from 37' away, but the beam will be 153' across! Thats a pretty big difference in distance from talent, but it's also a HUGE difference in spread - so choose wisely! If it's important to hold exposure on this backlight for a long walk + talk or something, it'll probably be easier to dial it in with the par - BUT your street can't be too wide. It'll take more grippage to do the same thing for the goya, but you'll have more flexibility in terms of spread. And truthfully, little issues are a lot easier to excuse or hide in backlight than they are on keys.


The more you know about your location beforehand the better prepped you can be - its really hard to guess these things day-of esp with "big" lights because you kinda need to get it right before planting your fixture - running power to a 4k or bigger is a slower task than with standard edison power. If you can scout and measure, pace it out, discuss the shot with the director and audio - you can do it the dorky way and calculate everything to the point that the margin of error is no big deal - so you show up knowing exactly where to place your light, where to run power, where to hide your genny, which lens to use, what additional grip will need to be rigged, etc... - the Arri calc is AWESOME for this, just try and get as much preliminary info as possible about your location - hard numbers don't lie. There's nothing like showing up with the 4k and saying "I really hope this works!" Much better to know it'll work - and time is much cheaper when you're on a computer than when you've got a crew waiting for you!
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