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Sony 4k Raw camera


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#1 Brian Drysdale

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 03:29 AM

Sony have announced their F5 and F55 cameras. Looks like they've used design aspects of a number of other cameras, plus I gather it has a global shutter sensor

http://pro.sony.com/...ighend-F5.shtml

You can record the 4K RAW footage with their AXS-R5.

Edited by Brian Drysdale, 30 October 2012 - 03:33 AM.

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#2 Brian Drysdale

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 04:36 AM

The standard codec is the new XAVC for intra-frame 4K at 300Mbit 4-2-2 10bit and 1080p at between 4-2-2 8bit 50Mbit and 10bit 100Mbit.
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#3 Brian Drysdale

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 04:55 AM

Here's pdf info on both cameras.

http://pro.sony.com/...f/F5_Camera.pdf

http://pro.sony.com/.../F55_Camera.pdf

The global shutter is the same as used on the F65.

Edited by Brian Drysdale, 30 October 2012 - 04:56 AM.

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#4 Brian Drysdale

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 05:58 AM

Film & Digital times summing up, plus some pics of hand held use.
http://www.fdtimes.c...ony-f55-and-f5/
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#5 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 07:27 AM

The standard codec is the new XAVC for intra-frame 4K at 300Mbit 4-2-2 10bit and 1080p at between 4-2-2 8bit 50Mbit and 10bit 100Mbit.


That's the confusing part -- 4K 10-bit 4:2:2 wouldn't be raw, so is that a separate recording format & recorder for 16-bit raw?
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#6 Brian Drysdale

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 07:50 AM

That's the confusing part -- 4K 10-bit 4:2:2 wouldn't be raw, so is that a separate recording format & recorder for 16-bit raw?


It seems that the RAW is recoded on a separate recorder (a AXS-R5 recorder that uses a new AXS Memory Card) which can be mounted on board as a module. With hindsight perhaps the thread title is confusing, the 2 cameras seem to offer a range of format options based on two different sensors.
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#7 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 11:44 AM

I handled one earlier, at the London launch event (I understand the US one was, er, rained off). It's a bit of a lump weight-wise but I guess that's what happens when you insist it's made of metal. In general looks quite good, very reminiscent of Alexa. The viewfinder is quite nice.

Really the proof is in the pricing.

P



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#8 Brian Drysdale

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 06:49 PM

Really the proof is in the pricing.


One Belgium dealer has the F5 at 15k Euros and the F55 at 19k Euros plus the VAT, no doubt the accessories needed for a shooting kit will add to those figures
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#9 Freya Black

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 07:00 AM

One Belgium dealer has the F5 at 15k Euros and the F55 at 19k Euros plus the VAT, no doubt the accessories needed for a shooting kit will add to those figures


I think it's really smart marketing to make it look so much like the Alexa, as it has definitely made it more of an object of lust in doing so judging by peoples reactions. Sony always seem really together with their marketing etc, but on the other hand they are apparently making a huge loss at the moment, but these are difficult times for a lot of companies.

Pricing seems strange to me however. 15k vs 19k. That means only 4k difference for the F55 which seems to be waaaaaaay better. Having said that I can't even afford the F5!

Looking forward to seeing some images!

love

Freya
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#10 Brian Drysdale

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 09:09 AM

I don't know how accurate these prices are, they could change, this happened with other cameras. Could be it was a web site doing an internet flyer, CVP don't have anything on the price and this is mentioned in the comments. http://blog.creative...evealed-f5-f55/

There was a good amount of comment on the poor ergonomics of other recent cameras, while the Alexa has had praise in that front, so it would make sense to move that direction.

Edited by Brian Drysdale, 31 October 2012 - 09:10 AM.

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#11 Freya Black

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 12:03 PM

I don't know how accurate these prices are, they could change, this happened with other cameras. Could be it was a web site doing an internet flyer, CVP don't have anything on the price and this is mentioned in the comments. http://blog.creative...evealed-f5-f55/

There was a good amount of comment on the poor ergonomics of other recent cameras, while the Alexa has had praise in that front, so it would make sense to move that direction.


Sony came up for some criticism in particular with the fs100/700 so maybe they have been considering that. It does look nice too and that's not to be entirely underestimated as a factor in some ways, as I guess if the camera looks nice the client may have more confidence in you! (odd but that's the way humans are!)

These cameras do appear to be genuinely interesting in spite of all the hype tho it must be said.
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#12 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 12:32 PM

19k is very cheap even if it were the cost body only without the 4K recorder, bearing in mind that you would need lens, viewfinder and batteries at a minimum, plus the recorder and media if you want 4K. The lenses alone could double that price.

Still, the proof is in the pictures.



P




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#13 Robert Houllahan

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 04:13 PM

There seem to be a number of places quoting the F5 as being a $15k body and the F55 as being a $25K body and that the 4K recorder for the FS700 will be $2K of course this pricing is not confirmed.

-Rob-
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#14 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 07:22 PM

Keen. And how much is an Epic these days?
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#15 Robert Houllahan

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 07:56 PM

Keen. And how much is an Epic these days?



About $35K for the brain, although JJ just announced that there will be price reductions.

-Rob-
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#16 Mark Kenfield

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 01:32 AM

I handled one earlier, at the London launch event (I understand the US one was, er, rained off). It's a bit of a lump weight-wise but I guess that's what happens when you insist it's made of metal. In general looks quite good, very reminiscent of Alexa. The viewfinder is quite nice.

Really the proof is in the pricing.

P


What would you guestimate the weight to be (rigged up with RAW-recorder, battery and EVF Phil?

The specs are saying just about 2kg for the body alone, so I was expecting a fairly lightweight setup (compared to Alexa, Epic and F65 at least).
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#17 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 06:55 AM

Those numbers sound about right. I think it's more a case of expectations and a density issue than an absolute weight one, as the thing is really quite small - it almost hid behind the Cooke lenses. Also being black with silver buttons and a nice colourful OLED on the side makes it subjectively look like a Sony camera, which one automatically expects to be fairly plasticky and lightweight.

The body probably is about two kilos, although by the time you've slapped a lens on the front, V-mount on the back, possibly the recorder, the EVF.... I dunno, it has to be three, probably three and a half depending on the lens. But it's not big.

P
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#18 Charles Zuzak

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 01:13 PM

Can someone explain to me why Sony is introducing a new memory format that is ASXM? I understand SxS Pro+ as a feasible low cost alternative for low bit rate recording. Why didn't they just sell SRMaster memory cards for the new external RAW recorder? Before someone mentions price, they have low speed 1.5 Gbps SRMaster cards already, which is about the same speed as these new ASXM cards. Isn't this just redundant and simultaneously, illogically confusing market segmentation?

Tl;dr: Promote SRMaster for RAW/high data rate external capture. Promote SxS Pro+ cards for internal low bit rate/ready-to-edit recording.
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#19 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 01:57 PM

Can someone explain to me why Sony is introducing a new memory format that is ASXM?


Because, er, because, er, because, er...

Why didn't they just sell SRMaster memory cards for the new external RAW recorder?


Er, because, er, because...

Isn't this just redundant and simultaneously, illogically confusing market segmentation?


Yes. That's basically what I was trying to say above.

I suspect they may be deliberately trying to segment their "really high end" SR market from their "not quite so high end" AXS market, but if that's the case it really is a desperately obvious and cynical attempt to do so.

P
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#20 Charles Zuzak

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 02:03 PM

What's really dumbfounding is that these new cameras are part of the CineAlta line. Shouldn't "high-end" SRMaster go with "high-end" CineAlta?
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