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Rust proofing old MR Baby Solar Spot fresnels


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#1 Gregg MacPherson

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Posted 27 May 2013 - 11:37 PM

I have a couple of old Mole Richardson Baby Solar Spot fresnels.  Very old,  they were set up with photo flood bulbs when I first got them.

 

They have some surface rust,  which I assume will extend into some of the spot welded seams.   If I refurbish them,  what is a good idea for treating that?  Some kind of chemical dip,  plating,  galvanizing?

 

I originally custom converted one to 650W tungsten.  Were there factory parts to convert these lights?   Do the parts for tungsten just fit right in?   Riser,  bulb socket.?

 

Thanks for any ideas.

 


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#2 dan kessler

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 01:04 AM

I also have a number of old fresnels, various manufacturers,
some with rust.  My plans are to do just enough and no more.
Not sure it pays to invest too much in them.  Try contacting
Mole Richardson for parts. (www.mole.com) You might also
contact a company called Pyramid Films. (www.usedmovielighting.com)
They manufacture new lights and refurbish used lights.
They will be able to advise you, I'm sure.
 


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#3 George Ebersole

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Posted 07 July 2013 - 06:11 PM

I have a couple of old Mole Richardson Baby Solar Spot fresnels.  Very old,  they were set up with photo flood bulbs when I first got them.

 

They have some surface rust,  which I assume will extend into some of the spot welded seams.   If I refurbish them,  what is a good idea for treating that?  Some kind of chemical dip,  plating,  galvanizing?

 

I originally custom converted one to 650W tungsten.  Were there factory parts to convert these lights?   Do the parts for tungsten just fit right in?   Riser,  bulb socket.?

 

Thanks for any ideas.

 

Treat it like any other rennovation.  Sand it down and paint over it.  It's funny, I've never seen an old rusty Mole Richardson light.


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#4 Gregg MacPherson

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Posted 07 July 2013 - 07:37 PM

Hey George,

That was actually a quartz conversion I did,  not tungsten.

 

The steel for the body must be fairly good,  because the paint was failing and crap steel would have quickly rusted to nothing..  But there is only a light spotting of surface rust coming under the paint.  The only thing I was unsure about for a repaint or restoration was where spot welded seams have no great protection.   I guess one can just seal that in with new paint over the top.

 

Very likeable old lights.  When they are unusable they will get turned into reading lamps,  then later perhaps,  lawn sculpture.

 

Cheers,
Gregg.


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#5 JD Hartman

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Posted 07 July 2013 - 08:11 PM

Use a rust conversion chemical like Ospho Metal Prep.  It converts iron oxide (rust) into a paintable phosphate coating.  If you paint over the rust, it will come back.


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#6 Gregg MacPherson

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Posted 07 July 2013 - 08:41 PM

Use a rust conversion chemical like Ospho Metal Prep. 

 

Any advice for seams where one can't get in.  I think there are a few spot welded seams.


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#7 Jason Fratis

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Posted 08 July 2013 - 02:50 AM

Pyramid films does not refurbish lights at least the ones they sell.  They also will advertise a picture of one light and send you something that looks 10 times worse.  

 

I have refurbished many MR lights including 200 mini moles.  Have the housings soda blasted and repaint with MR paint.  They sell the paint in rattle can form.

 

Just a note: Bondo will hold up on a 5k but glazing putty will not.  If you buy anything used from Pyramid expect to get sticky.  Im not squeamish around dents but i couldnt even use what they sent me.


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#8 Gregg MacPherson

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Posted 08 July 2013 - 05:49 AM

Thanks for the ideas you guys. 

 

Cheers,

Gregg.


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#9 JD Hartman

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Posted 12 July 2013 - 11:33 AM

 

Any advice for seams where one can't get in.  I think there are a few spot welded seams.

 

Ospho is a liquid, drip it into the seams.


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#10 dan kessler

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Posted 12 July 2013 - 02:05 PM

Pyramid films does not refurbish lights at least the ones they sell.  They also will advertise a picture of one light and send you something that looks 10 times worse.  

 

I have refurbished many MR lights including 200 mini moles.  Have the housings soda blasted and repaint with MR paint.  They sell the paint in rattle can form.

 

Just a note: Bondo will hold up on a 5k but glazing putty will not.  If you buy anything used from Pyramid expect to get sticky.  Im not squeamish around dents but i couldnt even use what they sent me.

Sorry to hear this.  Wasn't my experience when I dealt with them some years ago.

Bought a lot of stuff from them, visited their facility, knew the guys, always treated me right.


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#11 Gregg MacPherson

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Posted 12 July 2013 - 03:35 PM

 

Ospho is a liquid, drip it into the seams.

 

That may be almost the only option.  I had a quick look at what car restoration guys do.   Sofar (speed reading) it looks like rustkiller such as Ospho in a seam would need to be sealed.  I don't think I can do that. 


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#12 Gregg MacPherson

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Posted 12 July 2013 - 07:59 PM

Looking again at these old lights,  The cushion for the lens looks like aesbestos.  I'm guessing that there is a replacement part that is not.  I can't see the separate part in the drawings to get a part number,  but I just asked MR about this part in an email.

 


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#13 George Ebersole

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Posted 13 July 2013 - 03:17 AM

Hey George,

That was actually a quartz conversion I did,  not tungsten.

 

The steel for the body must be fairly good,  because the paint was failing and crap steel would have quickly rusted to nothing..  But there is only a light spotting of surface rust coming under the paint.  The only thing I was unsure about for a repaint or restoration was where spot welded seams have no great protection.   I guess one can just seal that in with new paint over the top.

 

Very likeable old lights.  When they are unusable they will get turned into reading lamps,  then later perhaps,  lawn sculpture.

 

Cheers,
Gregg.

 

Pardon my idiocy, are they spots or fills?


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#14 Gregg MacPherson

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Posted 13 July 2013 - 04:27 PM

@George

 

It looks like an old version of what MR call a Baby Solar spot.  Looks almost identical to this...

http://www.theoldcin...-c-7_117-p-8584

Mine has the odd kink in the yoke that you see here.  My yoke is cast brass.  It's possible that was a copy made here,  so may not be the original yoke.

 

Looking at the front of the light there is an extra sliding control rod on the bottom right that I think is just to give hard stops to the bulb position.

The fllod/spot range is really wide.  At 8' the flood is about 8' wide and the spot is about 1-1/2' wide.


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#15 Jason Fratis

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 01:55 AM

Sorry to hear this.  Wasn't my experience when I dealt with them some years ago.

Bought a lot of stuff from them, visited their facility, knew the guys, always treated me right.

If you visit and know them im sure your experience would be different.  Basically the "combo" stands they sent me could not be identified by manufacturer.  They not only were junior stands with no combo-ability but they each incorporated parts from every stand building company.  Was kinda amazing actually.


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#16 JD Hartman

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 11:51 AM

 

That may be almost the only option.  I had a quick look at what car restoration guys do.   Sofar (speed reading) it looks like rustkiller such as Ospho in a seam would need to be sealed.  I don't think I can do that. 

 

No you can't use a seam sealer like it was an automotive or decorative sheetmetal assembly,  The Ospho will stop, convert the rust and leave the metal with a primer like coating.  When you paint the inside of the housing, just run a little paint in there.  Any effort you make will be better than what you started with.  Is NZ that humid that exposed metal flash rusts instantly?


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#17 JD Hartman

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 11:59 AM

Pyramid films does not refurbish lights at least the ones they sell.  They also will advertise a picture of one light and send you something that looks 10 times worse.  

 

I have refurbished many MR lights including 200 mini moles.  Have the housings soda blasted and repaint with MR paint.  They sell the paint in rattle can form.

 

Just a note: Bondo will hold up on a 5k but glazing putty will not.  If you buy anything used from Pyramid expect to get sticky.  Im not squeamish around dents but i couldnt even use what they sent me.

 

What you say is true.  The fixture you buy is the first one they grab off the pile.  Bought some 2k Fresnel fixtures a few years ago, they arrived with chipped lenses and no barndoors, despite being in the item description.  An email to the owner of B&M resulted in an apology, two perfect lenses and two sets of doors.  Pyramid is owned by B&M and run by the brother-in-law of the owner.

 

Used grip stuff I bought from Pyramid was fine.  Just be very specific in your order and description of the item.  Shame that B&M discontinued the manufacturing of stand and other grip items,  Their design, quality and parts detail was top notch.  With the demise of Norms some years ago, the choices become more narrow.


Edited by JD Hartman, 16 July 2013 - 12:04 PM.

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#18 Gregg MacPherson

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 11:03 PM

 

No you can't use a seam sealer like it was an automotive or decorative sheetmetal assembly,  The Ospho will stop, convert the rust and leave the metal with a primer like coating.  When you paint the inside of the housing, just run a little paint in there.  Any effort you make will be better than what you started with.  Is NZ that humid that exposed metal flash rusts instantly?

 

I don't think we have a problem with"flash rust".  I was worried about unreacted Ospho in seams.  I think it's designed to be painted over.  Dribbled in paint over unreacted Ospho?  May be better than nothing.  I'm leaning to the Dan Kessler way now,  just do what I need to.  Actually there is very little rust on the inside of these lights.  Maybe the seams will be OK for another 60 years or so.

 

I cleaned a name plate and saw they are type 406,  No916.   I think they started making these in 1940.


Edited by Gregg MacPherson, 16 July 2013 - 11:06 PM.

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#19 JD Hartman

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Posted 30 July 2013 - 12:27 PM

How about some pics of the refinished heads?  Will you paint the interiors high temp black as most are inside or the less common white (more output)?  Ship on ControlBooth occasionally posts on fixture refinishing (which his shop does in large quantity) and goes into great detail on what separates a first class rebuild from a re-paint.


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#20 Gregg MacPherson

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Posted 30 July 2013 - 04:21 PM

OK,  will do,  but this fun project has to wait it's turn for now.  I did rummage through ControlBooth a while ago.  That was a good read.


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