Jump to content


Photo

Vision3 S8 Sampler

DIY Retro-8 Telecine

  • Please log in to reply
8 replies to this topic

#1 Anthony Schilling

Anthony Schilling
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1053 posts
  • Camera Operator
  • Portland, OR

Posted 05 November 2013 - 04:52 PM

Here is another sample of some Super 8 Kodak Vision3 50D,200T,500T film stocks. They were shot with a Canon 814-XLS and Nizo 481 Macro. I also used the Adnec pressure plate in the cartridges for better registration. Films were processed by Spectra Film in LA, and transferred with the Movie Stuff Retro-8 home scanner. The clip was edited with Sony Vegas 10. I did little to no color correction, but increased the saturation and contrast. I also applied some Neat Video noise reduction and a little sharpening in a few spots.


  • 0

#2 Alessandro Machi

Alessandro Machi
  • Sustaining Members
  • 3318 posts
  • Other
  • California

Posted 05 November 2013 - 05:09 PM

The sound of the projector turning off, a cruel sound indeed. Amazingly awesome looking stuff. Looks like you shot in soft but flat light outdoors which just seemed to turn some of it into 16mm.

 

How much is Spectra charging for negative processing these days? I hope it is enough to stay profitable because it would be a shame if the thing that makes super-8 look so good and potentially affordable also bankrupts the labs due to less transfer business.


  • 0

#3 Alessandro Machi

Alessandro Machi
  • Sustaining Members
  • 3318 posts
  • Other
  • California

Posted 05 November 2013 - 05:21 PM

I would like to co-opt this topic rather than start another one because the video sample provided above is terrific.  Is it time for the labs to start charging two processing rates? 50 bucks a reel if one just wants processing only, or 25 bucks a reel if one is doing the transfer with the lab?

 

And if that were done, than maybe labs could start selling these transfer units. It would be a weird transition, but if there were a thousand of these units out there, that might generate enough lab business to keep a super-8 lab in business simply by the processing only.

 

This is a common problem with technologies just before they potentially fade away, they optimize and are surprisingly good, but then sort of disappear overnight. In this instance, these types of transfer units could increase the use of super-8 again. But if at the same time super-8 usage is going up labs get hurt financially because their prior investment in transfer gear can no longer be justified due to loss of transfer business, then it becomes a catch-22. 


  • 0

#4 Anthony Schilling

Anthony Schilling
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1053 posts
  • Camera Operator
  • Portland, OR

Posted 05 November 2013 - 05:53 PM

I'm glad you like it! But I don't think labs have to worry much. Untill last year, most S8 film shooting was done on reversal that was mostly projected or home telecined with various methods. Since negative is the main option for color film now, i would assume they are doing more transfers than before. I'm the only one that I know of so far that is scanning neg with this machine. The only result is that i'm shooting more film now with an easier work flow. I was only paying for a high end transfer maybe once a year before, and I still plan to use that resource for a serious project or 16mm... but for now I am only buying more film from Kodak and sending more film for processing.


Edited by Anthony Schilling, 05 November 2013 - 05:55 PM.

  • 0

#5 Joerg Polzfusz

Joerg Polzfusz
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 123 posts
  • Other

Posted 07 November 2013 - 07:35 AM

Great samples! I thought that the 500T would have more grain...

Thanks for sharing!


  • 0

#6 David Cunningham

David Cunningham
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1049 posts
  • Cinematographer

Posted 07 November 2013 - 08:05 AM

Great samples! I thought that the 500T would have more grain...

Thanks for sharing!

 

Depending on the transfer, Spectra does some grain reduction.  500T in a raw scan is definitely more grainy than this.  But, their grain reduction is quite good.  Overall, I've been very happy with all the transfers from Spectra except 2 things:

 

1.) Sometimes it just looks too good (I know, weird complaint, but it looks unnatural for the format.)  Their system is fantastic with it's grain reduction and sharpening.  But, to some degree, it's just too good.

 

2.) Their Spirit (or really any Spirit) does not deal with frame instability (jitter) well at all.  It causes very weird morphing and twisting of the image.  If you have rock solid frame registration (pretty much impossible with Super 8) it's not a problem.  Also, if you're not over analyzing and looking for it, not a problem.  But, if you're being picky, it's definitely a problem.

 

I have to say, my Super 8 Vision3 50D wedding footage processed and scanned at Spectra looks amazing!  The colors are vivid, the images sharp and the grain super smooth and fine.  But, it almost doesn't look like Super 8.  So, I'm on the fence.


  • 0

#7 David Cunningham

David Cunningham
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1049 posts
  • Cinematographer

Posted 07 November 2013 - 08:10 AM

As for the original topic...

 

This is some great footage.  The retro8 does a great job and the use of sharpening, increased contrast and Neat Video grain reduction was well used.

 

The one thing about the Retro8 scanner is that it does give that slightly more contrasty look with negative films.  This definitely gives it a more retro/reversal feel than a "film scan".

 

I definitely like the projector sound.  Very cool!


  • 0

#8 Phil Rhodes

Phil Rhodes
  • Sustaining Members
  • 11944 posts
  • Other

Posted 07 November 2013 - 12:00 PM

Pretty good-looking stuff. Almost makes me want to shoot an entire short on super8, just to be ornery.


  • 0

#9 Anthony Schilling

Anthony Schilling
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1053 posts
  • Camera Operator
  • Portland, OR

Posted 07 November 2013 - 12:45 PM

As for the original topic...

 

This is some great footage.  The retro8 does a great job and the use of sharpening, increased contrast and Neat Video grain reduction was well used.

 

The one thing about the Retro8 scanner is that it does give that slightly more contrasty look with negative films.  This definitely gives it a more retro/reversal feel than a "film scan".

 

I definitely like the projector sound.  Very cool!

The raw scans are actually very low con. I increased the contrast signifigantly, and the color saturation slightly to make it pop.

 

I made some noise profiles in Neat Video by shooting a Kodak gray card with each stock. Then whichever stock I'm working with, I can apply the appropraite noise filter and it's always most accurate without going overboard. From there, I can increase or decrease the amount as well as sharpen. The full rez renders to bluray on the flat screen seem to hold the sharpness and look amazing.


  • 0


Gamma Ray Digital Inc

Glidecam

Willys Widgets

Ritter Battery

Paralinx LLC

Visual Products

Aerial Filmworks

Metropolis Post

Rig Wheels Passport

Wooden Camera

CineTape

The Slider

Broadcast Solutions Inc

rebotnix Technologies

Opal

FJS International, LLC

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

Tai Audio

Abel Cine

Technodolly

CineLab

Wooden Camera

FJS International, LLC

Abel Cine

Gamma Ray Digital Inc

Opal

Broadcast Solutions Inc

Rig Wheels Passport

CineLab

Metropolis Post

Aerial Filmworks

Ritter Battery

Willys Widgets

Glidecam

rebotnix Technologies

Visual Products

The Slider

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

Paralinx LLC

Tai Audio

Technodolly

CineTape