Jump to content


Photo

Location Lighting - Mixed Lighting

Location Lighting Mixed Ligt

  • Please log in to reply
9 replies to this topic

#1 Daniel O'Flaherty

Daniel O'Flaherty
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 10 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • London

Posted 12 January 2014 - 07:51 AM

Hey guys i'm new to this and thought I would hit you all with a question.

 

Im shooting a film in a fantastic location next week and one of the scenes is in the master bedroom upstairs in the house. There are two big windows letting in natural daylight. There are two characters (husband and wife) in the scene and I want the the husband to sit down =next to the bed with the table lamp on and use that as his key, and the wife to walk in to the room being lit by the daylight through the window. It should be a very cold cool scene but i want to use the different source of lighting to show their differences and isolation.

 

I tested some lights in the room with the little time I had in their the other day, I can put a kino flo outside one of the windows that the bed is pushed up against which does great but i'm having problems lighting tungsten source for the husband and mixing them. Any suggestions on the matter?

 

Also I have access to Kino Flo's and arri fresnels and i'm thinking of shooting the majority of the film with kino's as most of it will be in daylight and I want a very soft look. Ideas on this? Controlling spillage and lighting backgrounds with kino's? 

 

I know I have asked a lot here so thanks for taking the time and sharing your knowledge and experience


  • 0

#2 David Mullen ASC

David Mullen ASC
  • Sustaining Members
  • 19759 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Los Angeles

Posted 12 January 2014 - 12:06 PM

Pick a lamp with a nice shade that puts out soft light and use a bulb bright enough to get some light on the husband but don't expect it to overpower the daylight... in real life, it wouldn't unless it was dusk outside or the lamp and husband were really far away from the windows.  It would look more natural to have a mix of light on him and probably just be filled in a bit by the table lamp.


  • 0

#3 Daniel O'Flaherty

Daniel O'Flaherty
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 10 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • London

Posted 13 January 2014 - 09:11 AM

Thanks David great advice and I will take it in to account. Would you recommend something like a 60watt bulb in the lamp on a dimmer to control the spillage on the husband? And because i'm mixing lighting here should I be concerned about white balance? Thanks


  • 0

#4 David Mullen ASC

David Mullen ASC
  • Sustaining Members
  • 19759 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Los Angeles

Posted 13 January 2014 - 11:14 AM

I thought the point was to have the mixed balance. Carry a range of bulbs from like 100w down to 40w maybe. And a dimmer.


  • 0

#5 Alexandre de Tolan

Alexandre de Tolan
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 115 posts
  • Camera Operator
  • Sevilla, Spain

Posted 15 January 2014 - 04:50 PM

And because i'm mixing lighting here should I be concerned about white balance? Thanks

 

Yes. But it all depends on what you're looking for. If the scene asks for a slightly cool EXT and you have a sunny day outside you can simply choose a bellow 5500K color temperature on your camera if it lets you (around 4000K), to let daylight turn a little blue.

 

The INT bulb has to be halogen/Tungsten around 3400K that you can turn more orange (increasing the desired separation), by adding the right CTOs or CTSs (1/8 - 1/4 - 1/2 - Full). You can also play with the shade fabric (diffusion and color), to obtain the desired effect.

 

Remember that cloudy days have a higher K CT so dial the K on your camera accordingly.

 

If your camera has pre-determined K settings (5500K and 3400K), you have to WB to some sort of yellowish/orange surface or:

 

1. Balance to 5500K and let daylight be white (if sunny), or lightly blue (if cloudy).

2. Balance to 3400K, let daylight be really blue and add CTO/CTS for INT bulb

3. Balance to 5500K if it's sunny, let the INT bulb be really orange or control that cast with CTBs (1/8 or 1/4). If you want the EXT slightly blue gel the windows with CTBs at taste.


  • 1

#6 Alexandre de Tolan

Alexandre de Tolan
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 115 posts
  • Camera Operator
  • Sevilla, Spain

Posted 15 January 2014 - 04:58 PM

You also mention lighting the entire movie with kinos because it's a "daylight movie". They can be handy (even if I'm old schooled and prefer Fresnels mostly), but remember that if you need to augment the natural daylight (or simulate it for that matter), on that scene you are going to need a big source, ideally far away from the windows. Kinos aren't really suited up for that.


  • 0

#7 Daniel O'Flaherty

Daniel O'Flaherty
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 10 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • London

Posted 16 January 2014 - 01:31 PM

Hi Alexandre. Thanks for the tips. I want the room to be quite cool and white. I do have access to arri fresnels and redheads which I am bringing along to the shoot and 3 4x4 bank kino flo's. I was worried about using the Kino's to also light the background and was thinking about doing this with the redheads or fresnels with some CTB on, I have HMI's for downstair use which I can hit in through windows but I wont be able to use them for upstaris. Could the fresnels or redheads with CTB on be ('on that scene you are going to need a big source, ideally far away from the windows', could this be my solution to augment the natural daylight? Thanks Alexandre


  • 0

#8 Alexandre de Tolan

Alexandre de Tolan
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 115 posts
  • Camera Operator
  • Sevilla, Spain

Posted 16 January 2014 - 02:22 PM

Hi Alexandre. Thanks for the tips. I want the room to be quite cool and white. 

 

I see that you are in London. Since I'm also in EU I can tell you that normally we use the expression "cool" to identify a blue color cast (I do think that Americans do use the same expression).

 

In that regard your intentions are somewhat contradictory. Do you want a slightly blue tint from the light coming in from the windows or you want it white (neutral)? 

 

I have HMI's for downstair use which I can hit in through windows but I wont be able to use them for upstaris.

 

If you have an HMI in your arsenal that's your best bet to augment natural daylight. Why can't you use it upstairs? There's no need to hang it over there but you can bounce it from the floor to a mirror strategically placed (perhaps in the front building?)

 

I would then use the Kinos as a Fill, probably hanged over poles on your set (don't know what's the area but there's always a way to hang some lights). That's if you want total mobility and have the chance to make wider shots without worrying with tripods on the ground.

 

If you can manage a way to hang your Kinos to some poles you can also hang one of your redheads with some black foil to augment the table lamp if you need to.


  • 0

#9 Daniel O'Flaherty

Daniel O'Flaherty
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 10 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • London

Posted 16 January 2014 - 03:41 PM

I want the window light that's coming to in to be white. I never thought of that I guess I could try it out and see how it looks. I don't have a lot of room with the lights in the scene as the room is not that big, i'm trying to think of places out of frame where I could hang some lights t the moment. I will try to upload a picture of the location. Thanks Alexandre


  • 0

#10 Alexandre de Tolan

Alexandre de Tolan
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 115 posts
  • Camera Operator
  • Sevilla, Spain

Posted 16 January 2014 - 04:19 PM

A smaller room works in your favour. If the room is not that big you can try hanging your Kinos for Fill. 4x4 weights about 11 pounds each so if you are on a budget I recommend wall-spreaders. 

 

If you don't want to hang the heavier Kinos you can probably get away with hanging your lighter redheads from Autopoles (like Manfrottos). You have to diffuse and CTB them though.

 

A picture would certainly help. Try to post one of the EXT surroundings as well.


  • 0


rebotnix Technologies

Paralinx LLC

Abel Cine

Ritter Battery

Visual Products

CineLab

FJS International, LLC

Metropolis Post

CineTape

Broadcast Solutions Inc

Aerial Filmworks

Tai Audio

Rig Wheels Passport

The Slider

Technodolly

Willys Widgets

Opal

Gamma Ray Digital Inc

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

Wooden Camera

Glidecam

Tai Audio

Aerial Filmworks

Opal

Broadcast Solutions Inc

Gamma Ray Digital Inc

CineLab

CineTape

FJS International, LLC

Willys Widgets

Technodolly

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

Glidecam

rebotnix Technologies

Metropolis Post

The Slider

Paralinx LLC

Ritter Battery

Wooden Camera

Visual Products

Rig Wheels Passport

Abel Cine