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Beaulieu 200ft Magazine-- Using Bolex core adapters


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#1 Sir Alvin Ekarma

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 10:54 AM

I'm looking to switch out my gear and get a beaulieu and I wanted a clarification on the 200ft magazines: can these only be used with the hard-as-hell-to-find 200ft spools where you'd have to spool things off yourself in a dark room or could you you use something like the core adapters from a bolex magazine to shoot that way? (Apologies if this has already been covered; my initial search didn't find anything.)


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#2 Jean-Louis Seguin

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 01:05 PM

I don't think you will be able to load a full 200 feet on a standard 2 inch core, maybe only 170-180 feet.

Plus the throat that connects to the camera is not fully light-tight; it would need to be covered if mags are preloaded or the whole camera with mag attached would need to go into a changing bag for loading.

 

I think I might have a few of those 200 foot spools kicking around somewhere if you're interested.

 

Jean-Louis


Edited by Jean-Louis Seguin, 20 March 2014 - 01:06 PM.

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#3 Sir Alvin Ekarma

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 01:29 PM

Re: light tightness.But once the magazine is on, it's all good to go or do you need to tape up around there as well?

Anyway, I've heard that those magazines can be hassle but if I can get one at a price that isn't nuts, I'll hit you with a PM :)


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#4 Sir Alvin Ekarma

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 01:37 PM

Quick clarification: you can't load the magazine in a changing bag with a loop of film coming out and then feed into the camera body ? It has to be all done-in-a-bag or it's not happening?


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#5 Ian Cooper

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 02:47 PM

Quick clarification: you can't load the magazine in a changing bag with a loop of film coming out and then feed into the camera body ? It has to be all done-in-a-bag or it's not happening?

 

Well you can load the magazine in a changing bag if you want, but the spindle inside the magazine is a standard small square one -- the same as you have for a 100ft daylight spool, so cores won't ordinarily fit on unless you have some form of adapter, and by then I suspect the core won't quite hold 200ft.

Philip Rigby & Sons in the UK used to sell (4 or 5 years ago) new empty 200ft daylight spools, don't know about these days.  Might be worth an email/phone call to find out.

If you want I can take some photos of the magazine / 200ft spools.


Ian.


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#6 Sir Alvin Ekarma

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 03:51 PM

Pix would be appreciated, if just to see something I've never laid eyes on :)    Thanx!


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#7 Heikki Repo

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 03:55 PM

Wittner Cinetec (Germany) sells 200ft day light spools "Kameraspule 16mm - 60m"

http://wittner-kinot...mm/16_filmm.php


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#8 Sir Alvin Ekarma

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 04:04 PM

Thanks for the link :D   Even at US$20 plus shipping, that's good price. Now to see if I can snag a magazine..


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#9 Ian Cooper

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 06:23 PM

Pix would be appreciated, if just to see something I've never laid eyes on :)    Thanx!

 

Ok, here's the magazine:

13297070903_3cb807404e.jpg

 

13297289344_825108f622.jpg

 

Quite a nice self contained unit.  There are electrical contacts on the saddle to automatically couple up the torque motor, and a removable rubber bung that keeps the inside clean.

 

Opening up the magazine reveals it's all quite straight forward.  The 200ft daylight spools have the same size centre hole as 100ft daylight spools - so you could use the magazines with 100ft loads as well (although there seems little point).

 

13296907435_3a815f3931.jpg

 

The following photo shows the magazine loaded:

13297067943_1db28b0514.jpg

The unexposed source film is loaded on the left, passes over the roller at the bottom to form a loop through the aperature before then heading back inside to sit on the take up spool, which is connected to the motorised spindle.

 

To load on the camera you unscrew the cover plate from the top of the camera and screw the magazine in its place.  There are multiple recesses and lips, so it's all light tight without needing further external taping up.

 

13296904525_4e117ac5f3.jpg

 

The film enters the camera film chamber through the top, feeds around the sprocket and gate as per normal, then you fit a removable pulley over the spindle for the film to pass around on its way back up to the magazine.   I have to confess its a good few years since I used the R16, so I can't honestly remember if the pulley goes over the bottom spindle as I've shown in the photo, or if it sits on the upper spindle and the film goes straight up without looping around the lower one.   Instruction manuals for the R16 are freely available online, so it wouldn't take too much effort to double check which way it should go.

 

This is the final snap showing the whole lot...

 

13297064543_595a8486f1.jpg

 

Assuming you had an adapter to go from the small square daylight spool spindles up to a core, it would be possible to load a core of film into the magazine in a changing bag.  With the rubber bung in place the film is trapped in the aperture of the magazine, but there are no light traps so removing the bung might result in a bit of fogging.  If you kept the bung in place, only removing it to thread the camera with the whole lot in a changing bag, then it would be possible to avoid fogging.

 

The centre diameter of a 200ft spool is 31.5mm, whilst the outer diameter of a film core is 50mm, so using cores you'd be loading less than 200ft in the magazine to start with.


I quite liked using the R16 - not exactly quiet, but fairly light.  I'm not sure its as indestructable as a Bolex, but treated with care it was nice to use.  Whilst the speed isn't crystal synced, it does have a closed loop speed control system that holds pretty steady.  I'd use the rolling bars on a TV to get the speed as close to 25fps as I could.

 

Best of luck with your endeavours,
Ian.


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#10 Sir Alvin Ekarma

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 09:42 PM

Thanks for sharing. Currently I have an S16 bolex but I want to get a beaulieu and have it converted to U16 so I can have access to the variety of speeds, reverse filming and other options you can only get with some pricey mods for the bolex. Again, your info is much appreciated  :D


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#11 Ian Cooper

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Posted 21 March 2014 - 03:05 AM

Thanks for sharing. Currently I have an S16 bolex but I want to get a beaulieu and have it converted to U16 so I can have access to the variety of speeds, reverse filming and other options you can only get with some pricey mods for the bolex. Again, your info is much appreciated  :D

 

...be aware that you can't do reverse filming with the external magazine, as the torque motor is only connected to the 'normal' take up spindle.


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#12 Sir Alvin Ekarma

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Posted 21 March 2014 - 09:39 AM

I am aware of it but thanks for the tip:)


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#13 Bengt Freden

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 07:22 AM

Hello Ian,

Thanks for the very instructive photos. I have two of these light 61m/200ft magazines. And yes, you do need to have the film in the larger daylight 200ft spools, otherwise the risk of fogging the film is too great. The black rubber bung goes in the bottom hole, to keep dust and dirt out, and to keep all unwanted light out, if you pre-load the film with a long loop sticking out. On top of this, I always tape the edges of the mags with black tape, just to be really sure. If it's a very bright and hot day, I also slip a white ARRI leather barney over the mag to keep it a bit cooler (and even more lightproof, especially with some blackwrap foil around the mag  inside) - it also makes the mag more quiet, whereas the camera itself is still a bit noisy, as you mentioned. 16mm film is expensive these days, especially if you have re-spooled a 400ft load onto two 200ft daylight spools!

 

Although, you have to open it now and then (in the shade) to check on the film counter how much film is left. Wittner Cinetec in Hamburg, Germany, sells the larger 200ft spools:

("Kameraspule 16mm - 60m") - http://www.beaulieu....p?rubr=16_azub2

 

The little roller goes on the upper spindle inside the camera, by the way, so the film goes straight up without looping around the lower spindle, this might put too much stress on the film - this is shown in the R16 manual as well.

 

Best regards,
Bengt in Stockholm 


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#14 Jrn Michael Bakke

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 11:52 AM

hi!
I have used metal centercores from a Arri SR. It´s ok as long you have a spooling-desk in total darkness, and a changing-bag in the field.
Kadrew
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#15 Bengt Freden

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Posted 23 June 2014 - 04:44 PM

Hi Jrn Michael,

 

That sounds very interesting. How many feet of film did you manage to load in the Beaulieu R16 200 feet mag, and was it KODAK or FUJI stock? Acetate or thinner-based Estar/Polyester film?

I'd like to try this myself - I think I might have som 16mm core adapters lying around in a box somewhere...


All the best,
Bengt in Stockholm  ;)


Edited by Bengt Freden, 23 June 2014 - 04:45 PM.

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