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#1 Josh Monie

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 09:15 AM

I am just wanting some reassurance on a generator / HMI set up so if anyone can share some knowledge, please do!

 

We're going to be powering two Film Gear 2.5kW HMIs off a Honda EU65is genny which is advertised as 6.5kW but is actually rated at 5.5kW continuous. We'll be running 32amp extensions from the generator into a K9 32amp > 4 x 16amp box and the HMIs from there.

 

I'm fairly new to working with HMIs and have read a lot about crystal sync, etc. so just wanted to double check this sounds correct to you pros out there. I'm based in the UK if that makes any difference.

 

Thanks, Josh


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#2 Leonardo Brocato

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 12:19 PM

The best we got here is Guy Holt, owner and modifier of several of these generators.

But the Guy sistem it's great for 110v and you like me in italy use 220v so it's a little be different.

I know very well the honda 6.5 and i've pushed it since 5.2kw both hmi and tungsten.

You have to test with 2x2.5 hmi, it's not obvious, because are 2 big loads. Let one go completely up and then strike the other, try to run the couple at least for a quarter of hour, here in italy 2.5k hmi also the filmgear uses 32amp socket not the 16amp due to double uses also in 4k but in 220v are 10 amp. Don't go too far because 16amp are small wires and you lost power in distance.
If the ballasts are filmgear have power factor corrected, if you use power gems or similar i'm not sure are pfc corrected.
I think for your generator will be better if you can afford to rent instead 2 filmgear 2.5 two new Arri M18 hmi that use less power and give you the same if not more than two 2.5 filmgear....very sure about that
if the generator can't run two 2.5k you can try to use one 2.5k and a 1.2k or again two 1.8k this Honda exist also in 10k model wich can run also a 4k or three 2.5k.
Test one time the load to be sure or pick up a backup lamp maybe 1.2k because if you are shooting and because of load you lost a 2.5k it's half of your light and could be an exit strategy run the 1.2k.

Don't make the mistake of rent the old honda ex5500 the silver one because i'm absolutely sure you can't run more than 3k, in rental house in italy  always they try to give us the old silver ones instead of the red 6.5i that is very good.
 

Leonardo Brocato
Gaffer Rome Italy


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#3 Josh Monie

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 04:08 PM

Thanks for your response, Leonardo.

 

I will take your advice when striking the HMIs - let one come up for about 15 minutes or so then strike the other. I would have loved the Arri M18s but unfortunately the rental house didn't have any in stock and we are on a pretty tight schedule! 

 

We've got a 1.2K on standby as well as a bunch of 800W redheads which will just run through a standard 13amp 4-gang. Hopefully we won't have to use them.

 

Thanks again for your advice. 


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#4 Guy Holt

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Posted 22 April 2014 - 09:35 PM

If the ballasts are filmgear have power factor corrected, if you use power gems or similar i'm not sure are pfc corrected.

 

Don’t assume the Film Gear ballast is Power Factor Corrected (PFC). Even Arri manufactures both PFC & Non-PFC 2.5/4kw ballasts. To run two 2.5kw HMIs on a 6500W generator you will need the PFC ballasts because they are more efficient and will draw less current. But that is not all,  PFC circuitry also realigns voltage and current and induces a smoother power waveform at the generator bus. As a result, the ballast not only uses power more efficiently, but will also return less neutral current and line noise. 2.5kw electronic ballasts with PFC (like the Power Gems (PG) 425CDP, the Power-to-Light (P2L) 425LVI, and Arri 2.5/4 EB w/ALF) typically draw 11.5 Amps on each leg of a 240V power supply. Use this link for more details about the benefits to be gained by using PFC ballasts.

 

Guy Holt, Gaffer, ScreenLight & Grip, Lighting Rental & Sales in Boston


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#5 Josh Monie

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 04:53 AM

Thanks for your help, Guy. I have contacted the rental house to ensure we are using PFC ballasts.


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#6 Guy Holt

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Posted 18 May 2014 - 10:48 AM

We're going to be powering two Film Gear 2.5kW HMIs off a Honda EU65is genny which is advertised as 6.5kW but is actually rated at 5.5kW continuous. We'll be running 32amp extensions from the generator into a K9 32amp > 4 x 16amp box and the HMIs from there.... I'm based in the UK if that makes any difference.

 

For those wanting to do the same in North America, I have developed a new HD Plug-n-Play Pkg. that enables the paralleling of two Honda EU6500 inverter generators to generate 100 Amps of power. A complete system consists of two modified Honda EU6500s, a Paralleling Control Box, and one of our Transformer/Distros (either 60- or 84- Amp.)

 

Paralleling_Copy_HMI_Reverse_Master.jpg

Parallel operation of two Honda EU6500 generators made possible by our

new Paralleling Control Box)

 

The generators require modification to interface with our standard Paralleling Control Box, which syncs the frequency and equalizes the load between the generators. Our proprietary paralleling control circuitry uses the Pulse Width Modulation (PWM) of the generator's inverters to control the load sharing. The phase angles of the two generators are synchronized using open loop architecture. The final function of our control box is to switch the outputs of the inverters to a common bus after their frequencies are locked in step (same phase angle and time base.)

 

 

Paralleling_Copy_HMI_Master.jpg
(As demonstrated here, our new HD Plug-n-Play Paralleling System can power a 6K HMI

as well as 2-2k and 2-1k Fresnels)

 

To provide power that is readily accessible in industry standard outlets, our Paralleling Control Box is outfitted with both a 240V Bates receptacle, as well as a "Hollywood Style" 240V Twist-lock receptacle. The 240V Bates pocket is there to power larger HMIs than has ever been possible before on Hondas (4k - 9k ARRIMAXs.) The "Hollywood Style" 240V Twist-lock receptacle is there to supply power to either our 60- or 84- Amp Transformer/Distro. The Transformer/Distro serves several important functions in this system that enables two EU6500s to be paralleled (use this link for details), but its' primary function is to step-down the combined 240V output of the two generators into a single large 120V circuit (either 60- or 84- Amps) that is capable of powering more small lights, larger 120V lights (5-10k Quartz) than has ever been possible before on portable Hondas. Each of our Transformer/Distros is likewise outfitted with an industry standard 120V Bates receptacle so that you can use standard distro equipment, like Bates Siameses, Extensions, and Break-Out boxes to distribute power around your set, breaking out to U-Ground Edison Outlets where ever needed.

 

Paralleling_Copy_HMI_MidShot.jpg

Our 60A Transformer/Distro provides 120V power to smaller lights while a

6K HMI operates at 240V) 

 

An added benefit to using a Transformer/Distro to distribute the combined power of the two generators is that, no matter where you plug into the Transformer/Distro on its' secondary side, it automatically balances the load on the generator's two legs (which is critical for successful paralleling of two machines – use this link for details.) This feature also makes electrical distribution on set incredibly simple: you just plug in lights until one of the generator's load indicators reads 6000 Watts and the Transformer/Distro does the rest. But, the most important benefit to be gained by using a Transformer/Distro, the one that makes it possible to parallel two EU6500s in the first place, is that it isolates the generators from high neutral return currents that can lead to dangerous neutral “cross-current” between the two generators that can overheat their inverters (use this link for more details.)

 

By reducing the dangerous neutral “cross-current” created by two generators operating in parallel, our Transformer/Distros make it possible to operate more lights, or larger lights, on portable Hondas than has ever been possible before. Given the high sensitivity of HD camera systems these days, just about all the light you will need to obtain good production values can now be operated on our new HD Plug-n-Play Pkg. (use this link for more details.) Contact me if you want to retro-fit your Honda EU6500 for parallel operation without modification.

 

Guy Holt, Gaffer, ScreenLight & Grip, Lighting Rental & Sales in Boston


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