Jump to content


Photo

Kodak 500t with canon 514xls


  • Please log in to reply
15 replies to this topic

#1 RoryMcHenry

RoryMcHenry
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 10 posts
  • Director
  • London

Posted 04 June 2014 - 08:05 AM

Ok so I've searched these boards for a definitive answer and while there is a ton of useful information I'm still left a little confused...

I'm going on holiday in France this summer and intend to bring my canon 514xls to document my travels. I am new to this format and have only shot two rolls of film on it and I want to make sure I am doing the right thing (my previous rolls came out okay by just sticking them in the camera and shooting - the 200t looked nice in daylight but the 500t in a darkish interior came out very grainy but useable).

I'm planning on bringing some 200t for daylight use and 500t for night use. From what I understand the 200t gets exposed at 100 asa in daylight (correct me if I'm wrong) with the internal filter set to daylight.

The thing I need advice on is the 500t. I have read that the canon will expose it at 160asa in tungsten light (with the filter set to 'bulb'). But I have also read that the canon 514xls can meter at 250asa in tungsten light - thus creating a finer grain and less overexposure?

How do I get the 500t to expose at 250asa in the canon? Do I need to notch hack the cartridge and what should I set the filter to?

Sorry for the long question! But thanks for any help in advance!
  • 0

#2 Zac Fettig

Zac Fettig
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 338 posts
  • Other
  • Boston

Posted 04 June 2014 - 10:36 AM

The fastest the 514XLS will expose is 250, so the 500T film will meter at 250 automatically, in that camera. No need to notch it.

 

The 200T will be exposed as 160 (next speed down) without the filter and as 100 (with the filter in place).


  • 0

#3 Immanuel Wirt

Immanuel Wirt

    New

  • Basic Members
  • Pip
  • 9 posts
  • Student
  • Germany

Posted 04 June 2014 - 10:49 AM

I also think your camera will expose the 500T at 250 asa. The film should already be notched correctly, but since you camera only reads till 250 asa your film is getting 1 stop overexposure. The 200T reads at 160 asa so it gets 1/3 extra light.
When you set the filter to daylight, the filter takes about 2/3 stops of light. Because of the light loss of the filter the effective film speed is only 160 asa, but the film is still exposed at 250 asa; the camera will open the aperture 2/3 stops to compensate.

I would't worry thought. The film will easily tolerate 1 stop more light. The grain is finer when you overexpose film.
When you underexpose film and/or push process it, the grain will be more obvious. I think the reason your footage came out grainier in low light is because there was just not enough light, so the camera keeps the aperture wide open but beyond that it cannot let in more light, so the film may actually been exposed at 1000 asa.
You can only get more light on film by shooting at lower fps. Or setting up some lighting. Hope this helps.


  • 0

#4 Matthew W. Phillips

Matthew W. Phillips
  • Sustaining Members
  • 1792 posts
  • Other

Posted 04 June 2014 - 10:51 AM

The grain is finer when you overexpose film.
 

haha. It's Super 8, it is going to be grainy no matter what.


  • 1

#5 Anthony Schilling

Anthony Schilling
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1053 posts
  • Camera Operator
  • Portland, OR

Posted 04 June 2014 - 12:24 PM

If you are shooting at night with 500T, there is really no need to worry about what the camera is reading. Unless you are in a brightly lit stadium or using a light kit, when it comes to existing light at night you will need all the exposure you can get, even with a 500ASA film. If your camera could read the film as 500ASA, the aperture will still be wide open. Since it will be wide open when metering at 250ASA as well, it won't make any difference. The camera doesn't change the actual speed of the film, only how much light it will allow it and you will need all of it. 200T works really well in daylight, but you could also try some 50D. It is a little finer grain than 200T and will give you a better f-stop in bright sun.


  • 0

#6 Chris Burke

Chris Burke
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1675 posts
  • Boston, MA

Posted 04 June 2014 - 03:40 PM

Also wanted to add to the great advice already given that you should, if you can, avoid using the internal filter and use a much better glass 85 filter in front of the lens. The internal filters are over 30 years old, were made out of gelatin and therefor are quite degraded. It will make your footage look worse. Perhaps you want a rough image, but if you want really great looking footage, use a good quality external filter. If you are not able to use one, I would still recommend that you NOT using the internal filter at all, no matter what. Vision 3 Kodak film has very wide color latitude and during the transfer, it will be corrected.


  • 0

#7 RoryMcHenry

RoryMcHenry
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 10 posts
  • Director
  • London

Posted 05 June 2014 - 04:16 AM

Wow thanks for all the help that has really cleared it up for me!!
  • 0

#8 RoryMcHenry

RoryMcHenry
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 10 posts
  • Director
  • London

Posted 05 June 2014 - 05:47 AM

Actually one last question. 

 

Which 85 filter should I use if I opt for an external glass one? 85A or 85B or does it not really matter?


  • 0

#9 Zac Fettig

Zac Fettig
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 338 posts
  • Other
  • Boston

Posted 05 June 2014 - 07:19 AM

Actually one last question. 

 

Which 85 filter should I use if I opt for an external glass one? 85A or 85B or does it not really matter?

I'd go with 85B. It matters, but only a little, and a lot of it is stylistic choice.

 

An 85A will drop 5500K to 3400K, and an 85B drops 5500K to 3200K. So the 85A will give you a slightly cooler (more bluish) look. If it helps, the film (7213) is rated at 3200K.


  • 0

#10 RoryMcHenry

RoryMcHenry
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 10 posts
  • Director
  • London

Posted 05 June 2014 - 07:33 AM

Awesome, thanks Zac


  • 0

#11 Miguel Loredo

Miguel Loredo
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 143 posts
  • Other

Posted 06 June 2014 - 04:50 AM

1 stop overexposure is desired for Kodaknegative films. Even Kodak recomends to overexpose them! Just insert the cart and shoot.


  • 0

#12 RoryMcHenry

RoryMcHenry
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 10 posts
  • Director
  • London

Posted 06 June 2014 - 05:06 AM

Thanks Miguel!

Last question... If I use kodak 50D should I set the filter switch to daylight?

Or is that a stupid question?
  • 0

#13 RoryMcHenry

RoryMcHenry
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 10 posts
  • Director
  • London

Posted 06 June 2014 - 05:15 AM

That is a stupid question. Ignore it!
  • 0

#14 Joerg Polzfusz

Joerg Polzfusz
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 123 posts
  • Other

Posted 06 June 2014 - 06:13 AM

Nope, you'll have to set the switch to "bulb" (=no filter).

(Theoretically you don't have to do this as the Vision3 50D is correctly notched as "daylight balanced". Hence the camera should automatically disable the filter. But as disabling an already disabled filter doesn't hurt and as it's difficult to check whether the camera's automatism still works correctly....)


  • 1

#15 Zac Fettig

Zac Fettig
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 338 posts
  • Other
  • Boston

Posted 06 June 2014 - 07:09 AM

That is a stupid question. Ignore it!

 

“There is no stupid question! Except, possibly, a question not asked.” --Christer Romson


  • 1

#16 Anthony Schilling

Anthony Schilling
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1053 posts
  • Camera Operator
  • Portland, OR

Posted 06 June 2014 - 12:00 PM

Thanks Miguel!

Last question... If I use kodak 50D should I set the filter switch to daylight?

Or is that a stupid question?

The 50D cart does not have a filter notch, so inserting the cart removes the filter from the path automatically.


  • 0


Willys Widgets

rebotnix Technologies

Tai Audio

CineTape

Gamma Ray Digital Inc

FJS International, LLC

CineLab

Broadcast Solutions Inc

The Slider

Wooden Camera

Technodolly

Metropolis Post

Paralinx LLC

Opal

Rig Wheels Passport

Aerial Filmworks

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

Visual Products

Ritter Battery

Abel Cine

Glidecam

Gamma Ray Digital Inc

Ritter Battery

Metropolis Post

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

CineLab

Visual Products

Abel Cine

Opal

FJS International, LLC

Glidecam

rebotnix Technologies

Willys Widgets

Wooden Camera

Broadcast Solutions Inc

Technodolly

CineTape

Rig Wheels Passport

The Slider

Paralinx LLC

Aerial Filmworks

Tai Audio