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FRESH 16mm NEGATIVE B&W - PRODUCTION START

NEGATIVE B&W. 16mm film stock

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#1 Valerian E Partenie

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 09:49 AM

Hello everybody,

 

Being a "working on 16mm film" lover (after struggling with the film purchase...old stock usually) I start thinking on how to develop this 16mm NEGATIVE B&W film market (better say, to revive it hopefully once and for all!)

 

In conclusion, AS WE SPEAK, I am able to produce the following type of 16mm film, FRESH and in ANY quantities!

 

Type: 16mm negative Black&White

Film speed: 100ASA/21DIN, 200ASA/24DIN, 400ASA/27DIN

Perforation 1R

Winding: B on standard plastic core,

length: 400feet/roll

packed: sealed tin can (2 rolls/can! = 800feet/can)

The film is guaranteed to work within standard specs/each speed (specs printed also on leaflet).
 

Price: $160/can (2x400'=800')

 

I need you to help me with the following survey (and also I'm waiting for your questions!):

1. Is this an affordable price? he he

2. Which film speed you use most ? 

3. How many cans you will buy as the first order? 

4. How many cans  (800' of film) you think you'll buy/ month at this price?

5. Are you interested in buying the processing chemicals for it?

 

Please replay to this post as in the bellow example:

1. yes

2. 200

3. 2

4. 4 times/month

5. yes 

 

Please ask as many questions you like!! I'm really interested if this endeavor of mine might have a future!

 

Thank for looking!

 

Valerian 

 

 

 

    


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#2 Gregg MacPherson

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 01:40 PM

Valerian,

Can you give some details about your technical operation and the film.  One can't get a sense of the scale or what the quality might be like.  There will be lots of people who will give some support to this and buy some,  even if the scale of manufacture is tiny and the quality is lower and less consistent than Kodak. 

 

So maybe starting with the stock you are producing right now,  can you give some tech detail on that and put some processed samples online.

 

Cheers,

Gregg


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#3 Valerian E Partenie

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 02:16 PM

Hello Gregg,

Here are some answers to your inquires:
1. The product has not been publicly released yet.
2. The product will be produced and marketed in conformity with a quality system according to the international standard EN ISO 9001
3. It will be produced at an industrial scale in large quantity!!
4. It is NOT an experimental one! (made in my bathroom! he he) 
Soon I will be able to provide you the technical data and curves charts for each film speed (still editing the sheets for printing..)

So...considering that all the film specs are equal or 99% with the Kodak ones, can you please answer to the survey questions?
I just need to find if there are people interested in this project or it will die (I HOPE NOT!!!)
I truly hope that the people will love my price because I tried to make an affordable one for every film lover and I can't go lower than that!

Thanks for your interest!

Valerian

PS. I'm doing this because for more than 40 years I loved working on film and I sincerely think that if the BIG cinematography is going on digital (a CRIME in my opinion...) we, the small ones should gather together to keep the film alive (even 16mm B/W...but it is FILM! )!


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#4 Valerian E Partenie

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 03:04 PM

Production capacity:

 

I can produce multiple of 68 rolls (68x1, 68x2, 68x3 and so on) of 400' (34 cans) of each film speed. My intention is to start with the ISO 200/24...that means 68 rolls of this film speed (since it can be used both interior and exterior)

 

Therefore, for the first charge, I'm looking for 34 filmmakers to buy 34 cans (2rolls of 400'/can). If I can find them, then I can start the first charge...Or if there will be 34 filmmakers that want (all of them!) other film speed, I can start with the most requested film speed.

 

So, please anyone who read this post, be cooperative and say your opinion about this endeavor of mine! Ask questions and I'll do my best to clarify all the issues on this matter!

 

Valerian 


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#5 Gregg MacPherson

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 03:19 PM

Sounds great Valerian,

 

Answers to the survey...

 

1. yes.
2. 100ASA.
3. 1
4.  Six cans every two years as a single prchase.
5. Maybe.

 

Sorry I can't easily fit to question 4.  I would try some for a short project,  not more than about 4800' about every wo years.

 

If you do begin with several stocks at once,  what about offering a test pack of all,  maybe 100' each.  Price for that could raise to cover the labour and packaging.


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#6 Gregg MacPherson

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 03:30 PM

Valerian,

Do you have any samples of processed film you can put online?  Can you or your tech guy give some technical details?

 

What does the grain look like for the 100/200/400 ASA?

 

Is it a normal acetate base?

 

Cheers,

Gregg


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#7 Valerian E Partenie

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 03:47 PM

Hi Gregg,

 

Thanks for the answers!  

 

As I explained above (in the production capacity post...) the minimum quantity I have to produce is 68 rolls @400'/ea! That is the MINIMUM of each film speed! So, I can't produce some rolls of 100' @100ASA and some other rolls of 100'@200ASA for testing purposes...

 

All you can do is to buy the can (800'), then do the tests you want...If you don't like it, you can return the can with the remaining film [one of the rolls to be sealed (the one untested) and the tested roll, unsealed but with the  remaining film unexposed...of course) and you will be refunded 100% of the product value! However, you will not be able to make another purchase in the future (common sense...).

The payment will be made through paypal, so you are paypal protected!

 

Cheers,

 

Valerian


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#8 Valerian E Partenie

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 03:53 PM

Valerian,

Do you have any samples of processed film you can put online?  Can you or your tech guy give some technical details?

 

What does the grain look like for the 100/200/400 ASA?

 

Is it a normal acetate base?

 

Cheers,

Gregg

No samples yet..I will post the specs for each film speed soon (I already said that in a post above...please read it)


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#9 Philip Kral

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 04:22 PM

I can't help but wonder that someone out there that no one has heard of, has the facility's/ capacity to make movie film. Even more so if this film is panchromatic and they're doing the chemistry themselves. Makes me want to hear more of the backstory (Are your machines custom made? Are they from an old factory? etc) But It does peak my interest:

 

1. Yes.

2.Depends.

3. 1

4. 1 every other month.

5.Maybe

 

    I'm sorry my answers aren't so simple either. I utilize all kinds of speeds, depending on the project. I understand that you would like to make one run of 68 film rolls at a time of the same speed. Therefore, I'll take whatever speeds are the most popular for the first run you need. (E.g. If the other 33 filmmakers want 100ASA film, then I'll take it!).

   I also agree with Gregg, It's hard to estimate how much film I'll shoot a month. However, for 10min@ 80 bucks, I could probably shoot a bit more side projects then usual.

   As for the film chemicals, sometimes I develop my own film to save time/ money when doing tests in B&W. I also still do a lot of still film photography in B&W. I may consider buying chemicals from you depending on the pricing.

   Excited to see where this goes..... 


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#10 Valerian E Partenie

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 04:58 PM

Hello Philip,

 

Thanks for your interest!

 

I'm not doing it myself! I have done all the necessary arrangements (you may say rented...) a part of an existing motion picture film producer, to make only 16mm B&W negative!

So far, I have done my job. I have all what's needed to start the production. Now, with this post, I'm doing a market research to see if there is a response from the market....otherwise, my whole job is for nothing...

This being said, I can assure you  that the standard quality for this kind of products is met, guaranteeing that the products are conform to the technical specs (as I said the existing factory has all the facilities and is still in business, doing this for many years!) and I can guarantee the best price ! That is the entire idea!

 

So now I looking to find 34 buyers for 34 cans! I have saved your preferences...So far I may consider that I sold 2 cans! he he (yours and Gregg's) 32 to go!

 

As for "someone out there that no one has heard of" ...well, that's my moment! he he Now you've heard of me! he he

 

I hope my answer clarify some of your missing bits.

 

Cheers,

 

Valerian  


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#11 Kenny N Suleimanagich

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 05:32 PM

I would need to see samples, but I am interested. 


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#12 Valerian E Partenie

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 05:39 PM

I would need to see samples, but I am interested. 

Hi Kenny,

 

Thanks for your interest!

Please fill up the survey questions to have your specific interests saved.

 

Thanks,

 

Valerian


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#13 Gregg MacPherson

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 05:44 PM

... (you may say rented...) a part of an existing motion picture film producer, to make only 16mm B&W negative!

.... I have all what's needed to start the production. .... I can assure you  that the standard quality for this kind of products is met, guaranteeing that the products are conform to the technical specs (as I said the existing factory has all the facilities and is still in business, doing this for many years!) ....

 

 

Valerian,

Can you say who this motion picture stock manufacturer is?

Will this be identical or almost so to existing stock from that manufacturer?  If so,  which stock?

If you are editing data for your publication,  then you have data...we are hungry to know stuff.  Just post some key facts and answer some questions on the forum.  Better still,  introduce the lab technician(s) so they can do that.

 

I'm not normally a fan of Kickstarter,  but if your plan was to presell cans of film to pre-order the first run,  even with technical risks at that stage,  I think you would get the money.

 

I don't think you can afford to be seen as coy or stand-offish with sharing the tech details.  The tone of the social environment is very liberal.  You need a good reason to hold back.  It will be missinterpreted.

 

But even so,  I love the idea.  If you are hunched over a laptop in a tent in Uzbekestan running a scam,  I will be one very crushed film survivalist.  (this is a joke)


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#14 Valerian E Partenie

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 06:17 PM

 

Valerian,

Can you say who this motion picture stock manufacturer is?

Will this be identical or almost so to existing stock from that manufacturer?  If so,  which stock?

If you are editing data for your publication,  then you have data...we are hungry to know stuff.  Just post some key facts and answer some questions on the forum.  Better still,  introduce the lab technician(s) so they can do that.

 

I'm not normally a fan of Kickstarter,  but if your plan was to presell cans of film to pre-order the first run,  even with technical risks at that stage,  I think you would get the money.

 

I don't think you can afford to be seen as coy or stand-offish with sharing the tech details.  The tone of the social environment is very liberal.  You need a good reason to hold back.  It will be missinterpreted.

 

But even so,  I love the idea.  If you are hunched over a laptop in a tent in Uzbekestan running a scam,  I will be one very crushed film survivalist.  (this is a joke)

Gregg,

 

It seems that you are very impatient! he he I just told you a few times that the tech specs will be available soon!!

 

There is no need for impatience for 2 reasons:

1.There are plenty of cans to buy from!

2. At the above reason 1. the correct tense is "will be" plenty of cans to buy from!

 

You'll be the first to know about the specs, I promise!  

 

At this point in time I can't reveal the manufacturer nor any other manufacturer related details. However, the product specs (here we go again...) will be published for your enjoyment and study!

It is not a "kick starter", not a pre-sell nor pre-order ! I have NOT asked you of any money!! I just asked you to fill up the survey questions...and I WILL provide you the needed information!

 

Following your joke, from my tent in Uzbekistan I don't have the heart to break another's 16mm film's lover heart! So, it is not a scam!

 

Are we good now? he he

 

Cheers! 


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#15 Kenny N Suleimanagich

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Posted 06 November 2014 - 07:10 PM

1. Yes

2. Depends

3. 2

4. Depends 2-5

5. No


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#16 Valerian E Partenie

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 03:15 AM

 

1. Yes

2. Depends

3. 2

4. Depends 2-5

5. No

 

Got it! Thanks!

 

2 cans Kenny = 30 cans to go!


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#17 Oron Cohen

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 06:28 AM

1. yes.
2. depends on film grain, kodak 200 ISO too grainy, so considering that: 100ISO.
3. depends, if test could be shown online and looks good so 2-3, no tests online: 1
4.  5 cans every 6 months.
5. Maybe, if it’s easy to use.


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#18 Valerian E Partenie

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 11:15 AM

 

1. yes.
2. depends on film grain, kodak 200 ISO too grainy, so considering that: 100ISO.
3. depends, if test could be shown online and looks good so 2-3, no tests online: 1
4.  5 cans every 6 months.
5. Maybe, if it’s easy to use.

 

Thanks! I have noted your  preferences! 


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#19 Valerian E Partenie

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 11:21 AM

Here are the pdf files with the tech specs for each film speed:

 

 http://valeriansfreshfilm.com

 

Click on the pictures to see the pdf files online or right click ans choose "Save link as" to save the pdf on your computer 

 

Cheers,

 

Valerian


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#20 David Cunningham

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 02:28 PM

Do I assume correctly that this is either Kentemere or Fomapan film cut down to 16mm?


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