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[HCM-151- E] How to shot with low constradt and wide dynamic range?


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#1 Duca Simon Luchini

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Posted 19 November 2014 - 09:04 AM

Hallo Everybody,

I'm going  to shot with this camera (Panasonic 151) with maximum LOW contrast and with maximum wide dynamic range. Shortly, "shooting flat". I need an image recording profile  with "flat" contrast in order to preserve highlights and shadows at the extreme ends of signal bandwidth.

Unfortunately, Panasonic 151 has not something a LOG encoding or a a Cinestyle  camera profile. Reading the Manual, I found a pair of setting but I'm really not sure if them are what I need...:

In SYSTEM FREQ 59,9 Hz, you can choose DRS function (Scene file/DSR), that should increase the dynamic range. You can choose 1, 2, 3 but is really NOT clear what does it mean...

In GAMMA, (Scene file/GAMMA), you can also choose for a "gamma profile"... and in this case, I didn't understand if what I need is LOW or HIGH setting.

I didn't find any other way to shot with flat contrast, and with maximum wide dynamic range, as well.

Many anyone have experience about this recording techs? Any suggestions?

 

Many thanks for a reply!

 

 


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#2 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 19 November 2014 - 11:08 AM

Point the camera at an 11-step DSC chart and look at a waveform monitor and you'll quickly see which gamma settings give you the flattest image.


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#3 Duca Simon Luchini

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 02:16 AM

Point the camera at an 11-step DSC chart and look at a waveform monitor and you'll quickly see which gamma settings give you the flattest image.

Great David, but I didn't use (never...) DSC chart...

may you suggest me which type of DSC chart have I to use (I see many, many different chart on web...)? Or maybe there is something DSC chart printable?

Many thanks for a reply!


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#4 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 02:28 AM

Any grey scale would work.


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#5 Duca Simon Luchini

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 02:31 AM

And sorry, anyway what about DRS function (Scene file/DSR) setup, GAMMA function (Scene file/GAMMA) setup? Maybe you mean I have to check DSC chart for every DSR and GAMMA setup, to find something optimal to have flat contrast and wide dynamic range?

 

:wacko:


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#6 Duca Simon Luchini

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 03:01 AM

Any grey scale would work.

Okay David, something like this?

DSC-CDM100.jpg


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#7 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 11:38 AM

Yes, if you point the camera at that and look on a waveform monitor, you see an X shape of steps so it's very easy to see how different gamma curves are flattening or bending the steps and where white, black, and middle grey are being set.  As a basis for comparison, you might try finding a photo online of how Arri Log-C looks on a waveform and a DSC chart.

 

Now being only 11-stops it's not going to show you extended information but you can assume that if your gamma curve fits all 11 steps within, let's say 10% to 70% on the waveform, that means there is room to record more information above and below the black and white patch.  Arri Log-C shows that the Alexa captures a very wide range because the 11 steps show up between 15% to 65%, leaving quite a lot of area above 65% for overexposure information.

 

Probably on that Panasonic, there won't be as much range and switching between the gamma functions will make the X shape on the waveform either flattened horizontally (lower contrast) or stretched vertically (higher contrast), and some may favor the shadow end more than the highlight end depending on where the crossover point is.

 

A good test would be to have the chart set-up in one direction and then be able to pan over to a lit subject with a hot highlight (like a table lamp) in it to see how that gamma selected affects the real-world image, but generally you'd be aiming for something a bit washed-out, low-contrast, lower-saturation.


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#8 Duca Simon Luchini

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 09:51 AM

Okay David, many thanks!

Next week end I'm going to test all.

:D

THX!


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#9 peterasimmons

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Posted 04 December 2014 - 04:14 PM

Set gamma to Cine D, matrix to "normal" (if you're grading in post) or "cinelike" if you're not planning on grading. It also makes sense to dial down the detail level and maybe reduce chroma by a notch or two. This will give a flat look, similar to tecnicolor Cinestyle, suitable for maximising dynamic range when you grade in post. There's plenty of information about Panasonic gamma settings in The DV Rebel's Guide, available as an ebook on Kindle. The book talks about the HVX 200, but the info is just as relevent to other Panasonic cameras. Also, there are plenty of scene file recipes to be found on the net (mostly for the HVX200 and HPX170 but easily adapted to other Panasonic cams.)
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#10 Duca Simon Luchini

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Posted 06 December 2014 - 02:51 AM

Set gamma to Cine D, matrix to "normal" (if you're grading in post) or "cinelike" if you're not planning on grading. It also makes sense to dial down the detail level and maybe reduce chroma by a notch or two. This will give a flat look, similar to tecnicolor Cinestyle, suitable for maximising dynamic range when you grade in post. There's plenty of information about Panasonic gamma settings in The DV Rebel's Guide, available as an ebook on Kindle. The book talks about the HVX 200, but the info is just as relevent to other Panasonic cameras. Also, there are plenty of scene file recipes to be found on the net (mostly for the HVX200 and HPX170 but easily adapted to other Panasonic cams.)

Hi p,

okay, i'll try it. Yes, what I want is a "cinestyle flat look" suitable for maximising dynamic range cause I'm gonna grade videos in post.

What about "Scene file recipes"? How do they works? How to setup them and so on...? Please more info about would be great.

MAny, many thnaks!


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#11 Duca Simon Luchini

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Posted 06 December 2014 - 03:33 AM

Okay, I found something about Scene files in the Manual (installation, setup, etc...), but can you maybe suggest me some specific Scene file for flat look with high dynamic range and where can i find it?

Many thanks!


Edited by Duca, 06 December 2014 - 03:33 AM.

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