Jump to content




Photo

Using 'overhead' stands instead of 'combo' stands for lights?


  • Please log in to reply
11 replies to this topic

#1 Mark Kenfield

Mark Kenfield
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 712 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Melbourne, Australia

Posted 16 February 2015 - 12:58 AM

Hi Guys,

 

I recently went through a bit of a debacle with a set of Matthews Triple-Riser combo stands I bought - basically they're much bigger packed down, than is stated online, so they wouldn't fit in my ute. This forced me to get rid of them (at a rather frustrating loss), and now I need replacements.

 

The maximum closed length I can fit into the ute is 1.45m/4.75', which rules out every triple-riser combo in existence except for the Kupo 'Master High Cine Stands'. Which I've never seen with my own eyes (they're not a common brand down here in Australia) but I've seen some Kupo gear and it's been very nice.

 

Double-riser combos don't go high enough, so they're out of contention too. However I've stumbled across the Avenger "A3042CS Medium Overhead Stand" 

 

And it seems a good match for the specs I want - goes up to 4.2m high, supports up to 40kg, Avenger's terrific build-quality, and it packs down to just 135cm in length.

 

I'm sure it'll be great for supporting my 12x12 overheads, but I'm wondering if there are any gotchas I should look out for when it comes to using the 'overhead' stands to support lights? Is the way the legs are more horizontal than a conventional combo stand likely to make them less stable or capable of supporting a heavier item above them? What's the catch?

 

My biggest lights at the moment are a 1.2k HMI PAR and Arrilite 2000s, so there's nothing too big they'd have to support. The biggest units these stands would likely be used for are an Arri M18 or a 5K Fresnel.

 

Any help would be much appreciated - as it's damn near impossible to find info on overhead stands online.

 

Cheers,

Mark

 

 


  • 0




#2 Sanjay Sami

Sanjay Sami
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 258 posts
  • Grip
  • Anywhere they pay me to go

Posted 17 February 2015 - 08:11 AM

Although the rated load on those stands is 4.5 kg, I am fairly confident they will take a lot more than that. I think they will work fine for the purpose you intend. A 1.2 or 2K should be no issue.


  • 0

#3 Mark Kenfield

Mark Kenfield
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 712 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Melbourne, Australia

Posted 17 February 2015 - 04:27 PM

Thanks Sanjay, It says the load capacity is 40kg at maximum extension and drops to 4.5kg at a 6 degree incline, which is the same specs as my A4050CS boom stand - and that thing's a beast. So I'm confident they can handle the weight, it's the stability of the flatter legs and the smaller spacing between the two contact points of the base that I worry about.

Edited by Mark Kenfield, 17 February 2015 - 04:28 PM.

  • 0

#4 Sanjay Sami

Sanjay Sami
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 258 posts
  • Grip
  • Anywhere they pay me to go

Posted 18 February 2015 - 07:07 AM

Dont squeeze the legs down to their widest, that will give you a wider spacing . The Avengers are very well made. I wouldn't worry at all.


  • 0

#5 Mark Kenfield

Mark Kenfield
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 712 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Melbourne, Australia

Posted 20 February 2015 - 08:11 PM

Thanks Sanjay, I went and checked out one of the Avenger overhead models yesterday, but it turns out the grip head is permanently fixed to the top riser, so the stands can't be packed down neatly enough to fit anyway.

 

Do you ever use extension risers on top of combo stands to get things higher up? Are they stable enough to be safe?


  • 0

#6 Edward Lawrence Conley III

Edward Lawrence Conley III
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 128 posts
  • Other
  • Los Angeles CA

Posted 21 February 2015 - 06:33 PM

Well this is info after the fact but those Matthews combos could have been cut down to fit the UTE.
Same with the Avenger stands.

I'll have to look at an Avenger but I think the grip head is held in place with roll pins, knock em out with a punch. Pretty easy.

Of course this does take away from their overall height but if you just need a few inches less to fit it can be done.

Take the collars off and cut the risers. Don't cut the bottom of the riser because they are flared to keep them from sliding out of the collar when extended.
  • 0

#7 Mark Kenfield

Mark Kenfield
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 712 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Melbourne, Australia

Posted 22 February 2015 - 05:51 PM

Only if I cut the legs significantly shorter (about 20cm), and that would require having a much narrower (and therefore less stable) footprint than I'd like.
  • 0

#8 Edward Lawrence Conley III

Edward Lawrence Conley III
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 128 posts
  • Other
  • Los Angeles CA

Posted 22 February 2015 - 09:01 PM

You don't cut the legs, you take 20cm off the risers.

That's if the stand still works for your needs with 20cm off the height.
  • 0

#9 Mark Kenfield

Mark Kenfield
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 712 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Melbourne, Australia

Posted 22 February 2015 - 11:45 PM

That's impossible, the collapsed length of the stand is the sum total of the receiver sections of each riser and the length of the legs. Shortening the risers isn't going to reduce that collapsed length in any way.


  • 0

#10 Sanjay Sami

Sanjay Sami
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 258 posts
  • Grip
  • Anywhere they pay me to go

Posted 23 February 2015 - 07:18 AM

Thanks Sanjay, I went and checked out one of the Avenger overhead models yesterday, but it turns out the grip head is permanently fixed to the top riser, so the stands can't be packed down neatly enough to fit anyway.

 

Do you ever use extension risers on top of combo stands to get things higher up? Are they stable enough to be safe?

I dont (or very rarely) use extension risers. They are used frequently though. I prefer to get a bigger stand. They torque the stand a lot more than the stand was designed to bear , especially in windy conditions or any kind of offset load.


  • 0

#11 Edward Lawrence Conley III

Edward Lawrence Conley III
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 128 posts
  • Other
  • Los Angeles CA

Posted 23 February 2015 - 05:39 PM

That's impossible, the collapsed length of the stand is the sum total of the receiver sections of each riser and the length of the legs. Shortening the risers isn't going to reduce that collapsed length in any way.

 

Doh!  Sorry about that- it was a couple Hi Hi roller stands we did it to. Different legs.


  • 0

#12 Mark Kenfield

Mark Kenfield
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 712 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Melbourne, Australia

Posted 23 April 2015 - 06:20 AM

As a little update to this thread, I ended up going with four of the Kupo 'Master High Cine Stands', their triple-riser combos. And in short? I'm delighted. Build quality is superb, much better than the Matthews and not far off the Avengers, and the design is fantastic, significantly more compact when folded up than any other triple-riser out there.

They also have a triple-function head which allows you to secure the 16mm/baby pin at 90 degrees in addition to straight up, this is super handy for certain rigging jobs, as you can mount your light in the junior receiver and then use the baby pin at 90 degrees to attach a flag or frame to the same stand - very efficient stuff.

I'm now a definite fan of the Kupo gear. They also make these brilliant quick setup c-stand bases which setup in seconds - they bring a smile to my face every time you open or close them. They'd easily save you several minutes over the course of a shooting day.
  • 0


Rig Wheels Passport

Tai Audio

Pro 8mm

Willys Widgets

Abel Cine

CineTape

Technodolly

Glidecam

rebotnix Technologies

Ritter Battery

Paralinx LLC

Zylight

The Slider

Visual Products

Broadcast Solutions Inc

Aerial Filmworks

CineLab

CineTape

Pro 8mm

rebotnix Technologies

Broadcast Solutions Inc

Tai Audio

Zylight

Willys Widgets

Visual Products

Technodolly

The Slider

Rig Wheels Passport

Aerial Filmworks

Abel Cine

CineLab

Paralinx LLC

Glidecam

Ritter Battery