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Hazer or fazer?


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#1 Jonathan O'Neill

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 09:54 AM

I'm looking to get a Hazer, probably the "American DJ Haze Generator" (other brand name Antari HZ-100) http://www.antari.co...b/Products_i/22

 

but are also weighting up a water based fazer:  http://www.antari.co.../Products_i/103

 

I'm more interested in the hazer due to the finer look on screen and slower dispersion. But I'm worried about any health risks or residue covering everything, lenses included, with the oil based hazer. Does anyone find this a problem/issue?

 

I'm not too bothered about fire alarms, as generally we have the option to turn off or cover them. And it would mostly be used in fairly small locations, for 3-4 hours in each.

 

Thanks


Edited by Jonathan O'Neill, 27 May 2016 - 09:58 AM.

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#2 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 10:29 AM

I'd be surprised if the Hazer used an oil based fluid, as it's illegal in a lot of countries. It's more likely a glycol based liquid, and should be non-toxic and harmless to people and equipment.


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#3 Jonathan O'Neill

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 10:55 AM

Does look like Oil?

 

Antari_haze_liquid.jpg


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#4 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 02:04 PM

If it is indeed oil based, it might well be classified as a hazardous substance, as mineral oils are carcinogenic. That would mean that there were strict rules regarding the level and duration of exposure to it. You'd also be required to supply some sort of breathing apparatus to anyone who was going to be exposed to it.

 

You could ask the manufacturer for the data sheet this product, but there are plenty of glycol based alternatives, which are just as inexpensive.


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#5 aapo lettinen

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 02:44 PM

looks like oil based according to the msds:  http://www.elationli...HZL-1 (OIL).pdf   

 

 

FORMULA: Pure grade Lubricating Base Oil. II. PHYSICAL PROPERTIES

APPEARANCE AND ODOR
BOILING POINT (760 mm Hg) EVAPORATION RATE (Butyl Acetate=1) SPECIFIC GRAVITY (H
2O=1) SOLUBILITY IN WATER
VAPOR PRESSURE AT 20 C
VAPOR DENSITY (air=1)

III. INGREDIENTS

Pale green, pale red, clear, clear, clear; slight odor 210-435F
.003 - .006
1.075 - 1.085 AT 20 C

Completely soluble over 65 F <.025 - .0245 mm Hg
3.85 - 3.93

These products are all "Oil-based" Mineral oil solutions. As such, toxicity is minimal. These products have been shipped internationally for more than 5 years under the Antari name, and are considered "non- hazardous" by most national health and safety regulatory bodies.

Tests conducted by independent laboratories have confirmed the non-hazardous nature of these liquids. 


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#6 aapo lettinen

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 02:50 PM

yeah a glycol based hazer would be better option and probably also cheaper to use. (a common trick is to add distilled water to smoke fluid to dilute it enough to get reasonable quality haze fluid, is cheaper than buying dilute hazer fluid of which most of is water anyway. but the hazer manufacturers may not encourage that practice)

 

glycol based hazers are quite harmless unless you have bad asthma...  the main ingredients are ethylene/propylene glycol and distilled water


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#7 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 02:50 PM

Actually, the Material Data Safety Sheet from the manufacturer lists the ingredients as Glycol and Water. No mention of any oil.


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#8 aapo lettinen

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 02:53 PM

Actually, the Material Data Safety Sheet from the manufacturer lists the ingredients as Glycol and Water. No mention of any oil.

 

are you sure you have the correct sheet, my sheet says clearly that it is mineral oil based?


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#9 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 02:54 PM

Aapo, your sheet is dated 2008, mine is 2015. I guess they have changed the ingredients, at least for the European market.

 

http://www.highlite....tari-Hazerfluid


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#10 aapo lettinen

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 03:00 PM

Aapo, your sheet is dated 2008, mine is 2015. I guess they have changed the ingredients.

 

hmm I found a 2013 dated sheet which says the main ingredient is GLYCERIN. looks like they have changed it multiple times (quite hilarious when you think of it, mineral oil=hazardous, glycerin= less hazardous, glycol=even less hazardous...) . weird that they kept the product name intact despite they completely replaced it multiple times, I think it would even be illegal in some countries :blink:


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#11 Landon D. Parks

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 03:16 PM

Having used hazer's in many stage productions, I can say I have never used one that would accept oil based fluid. The fluid we always used was the same fluid used in fog machines, only slightly altered. 


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#12 Jonathan O'Neill

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 05:55 PM

So are all oil based hazers illegal? Df-50, le maitre, cirro etc?
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#13 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 05:57 PM

It's not that they're illegal per se, it's that mineral oil can be a carcinogen, so there may be restrictions on exposure. More pertinently, many locations will not allow you to use an oil based haze or smoke, even if the manufacturer says it's safe.


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#14 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 27 May 2016 - 06:05 PM

Also, even though Cal-OSHA (California Health & Safety) say that things like DF-50 are safe, they still advise the use of respirators when exposed to it. Obviously we don't do that for practical reasons, but the fact remains that breathing a vaporised oil can't be good for your lungs.

 

I know that the OP is in the UK, but these things are largely the same in most western nations.


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#15 Jonathan O'Neill

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 02:54 PM

Whats a good Glycerin fazer?

Edited by Jonathan O'Neill, 28 May 2016 - 02:54 PM.

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#16 Landon D. Parks

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 07:28 PM

Most any should work, just make sure the wattage matches what you need. If you're trying to Haze a large area in a short amount of time, then you need a higher wattage hazer. I would just caution to stay away from the Chauvet and American DJ line, as those can be, well, a little on the cheap side - and I don't just mean in price. Anything over the $500 US range should be a good starting point. 


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