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Credits - again


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#1 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 28 July 2016 - 06:29 PM

This does keep coming up.

 

Let's ignore the fact that the title "director of photography" is commonly taken by anyone who shot a cellphone clip that appeared on the news, and take things at least a bit more seriously than that. Unless the role involved running a crew numbering eight or ten qualified people, with credits on productions that went to a wide release, nobody has any business taking that title.

 

The word "cinematographer" either means much the same thing, or is so broad as to be meaningless, depending on context.

 

"Cameraman" could mean anything from news upward. "Lighting cameraman" is, I get the impression, an old BBC term that begs total incomprehension outside the UK and even within it is often misapplied; it can sometimes imply a very specific circumstance which doesn't really exist anymore, and in that sense risks accusations of posing in much the same way as calling oneself a director of photography.

 

Therefore, what credit are people who do wall-to-wall low-end youtube crap supposed to take?

 

Not that I'm particularly hungry to be associated with most of the stuff I do, but if they really want to, there has to be some sort of title above your name, fer chrissake. I have occasionally settled upon the phrase "camera and lighting" on the basis that it's purely descriptive and I'm not aware of any preexisting claim on it having a special meaning.

 

P


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#2 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 28 July 2016 - 07:13 PM

I think "cinematographer" or "cinematography by" is fine even for a small production, it doesn't imply a larger support crew one way or the other.  What's wrong with it having a broad definition? "Producer" is even broader!


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#3 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 28 July 2016 - 09:23 PM

"Lighting cameraman" is, I get the impression, an old BBC term that begs total incomprehension outside the UK and even within it is often misapplied;

 

Lighting Cameraman used to be the title that most non-narrative cameramen at the BBC used, until it became fashionable to use Director of Photography, which up until that point was reserved for those shooting narrative work, particularly movies. Even though Lighting Cameraman was common at the BBC, it actually comes from the old British studio system, where there would be both a "Lighting Cameraman" and an "Operating Cameraman". I believe that in those days the two roles were equal in seniority.


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#4 Richard Boddington

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Posted 28 July 2016 - 09:44 PM

Who on this forum is either not a "director" or a "director of photography?" :)

 

I didn't feel comfortable introducing myself in social situations as a "film director" until after I had done three feature films.

 

Look at the number of er um, "younger" people here with obviously zero industry credentials who call themselves a director or a director of photography.

 

R,


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#5 Justin Hayward

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Posted 28 July 2016 - 10:40 PM

 

I didn't feel comfortable introducing myself in social situations as a "film director" until after I had done three feature films.

 

 

I also didn't feel like I should change my title on this forum to "director" until directing was no longer a hobby, but my day job.  Granted, I direct mostly low end commercials.

 

Weird thing... I've always wanted to direct movies since I knew what directing a movie was, but I feel like I'm only learning now (at 38 years old) what it means to make a good movie.  Although I've had this conversation in my head about every year of my life, so next year I'll think I'm on to something new :)

 

Of course I'm not mentioning that the best films start on paper...


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#6 Satsuki Murashige

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Posted 28 July 2016 - 10:59 PM

What's wrong with 'Cinematographer' again?

I tend to think of 'Director of Photography' as a job description for a specific project rather than a vocation, if that makes sense.

Here's a longer definition that I wrote on Quora: https://www.quora.co...&share=c6ea895b
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#7 Dom Jaeger

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Posted 28 July 2016 - 11:18 PM

I don't know, surely a cinematographer is more than just a person who owns a video camera? That would mean everyone with a smart phone is now a cinematographer.

 

I think maybe a new term should be introduced, perhaps "youtubographer"?

 

Or, since there's really no need to get all fancy pants about it, how about just "camera dude".

 

 


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#8 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 28 July 2016 - 11:27 PM

The feature film "Tangerine" was shot on an iPhone... the device used isn't the issue, nor is the budget level, and in terms of the credit, not even the skill level, just that you did the traditional work of a cinematographer.


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#9 Satsuki Murashige

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Posted 28 July 2016 - 11:37 PM

Or, since there's really no need to get all fancy pants about it, how about just "camera dude".


I've been called 'Camera Dude' before, that's not so bad! Was also once called 'Tool Man' by E40 while 1st AC'ing on one of his music videos. So there's that.
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#10 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 29 July 2016 - 03:03 AM

Who on this forum is either not a "director" or a "director of photography?"

 

Me!

 

 

 

What's wrong with 'Cinematographer' again?

 

Eh. I dunno. Seems a bit putting-on-airs to me. I'd take "camera dude," but nobody here says "dude."


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#11 Gregg MacPherson

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Posted 29 July 2016 - 03:18 AM

In this brutal age where the more esoteric and arcane nature of photography is being squeezed out(sigh), how about being called "photon distribution manager".
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#12 Mark Kenfield

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Posted 29 July 2016 - 03:36 AM

I've been credited with 'Shot By', and 'Shot & Chopped By' (for a couple of projects that I've edited as well).

I quite liked that (for something different).

But then I'm not too fussed about credits anyway, I have a slight preference for 'Cinematographer', but 'Director of Photography' causes me no discernible grief.

The only thing that does irritate me a little (because I'm petty I suppose), is people taking the bigger titles when they've really only functioned as a 'Camera Operator', to me that's cheating a bit.

Obviously Operating is a huge (and hugely important) job on set, but it's only half the job IMO.
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#13 Brian Drysdale

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Posted 29 July 2016 - 05:15 AM

Lighting Cameraperson is a grade in BECTU and probably covers many people working in TV. BBC used to have film cameraman for that and I still see film editor coming up on some recent programmes.

 

On a short drama film I made years ago I put writer.director/photography in the credits. I wasn't planning to do camera, but it kept us on budget (the crew and cast got paid).


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#14 Peter Bitic

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Posted 29 July 2016 - 08:16 AM

What about just "Camera: ______"? It implies higher position than "cameraman" but does not come across as pompous as "director of photography" or "cinematography" in situations where such titles might be a little too much.


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#15 John E Clark

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Posted 29 July 2016 - 11:24 AM

What the title for 'do everything because my acquaintances won't work for free'... As it is for my and other people's short films I've mostly done directing/writing/sound/editing/photography.

 

If I'm working on someone else's short film, I have tended mostly to director/writer/editing/sound. Everyone wants to be the 'director of photography' or 'cinematographer' so I've tended to take up these other areas that are often totally lacking... not that I'm a mayvn in say sound or writing... but given the 'scripts' and audio or editing tools some of the people have had... I'm a veritable wunderkind...

 

 

Oh yeah... lighting too...

 

To me DoP is totally pretentious for a really small project, especially if the 'dop' is the only one shooting the camera and setting up the lights... if any...

 

I' think of 'director' requiring some crew to direct.


Edited by John E Clark, 29 July 2016 - 11:29 AM.

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#16 Michael LaVoie

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Posted 29 July 2016 - 12:27 PM

Therefore, what credit are people who do wall-to-wall low-end youtube crap supposed to take?

 

P

As far as skillsets, I think if you know how to adjust the lighting in your environment to suit your camera settings you're a DP.  A Videographer adjusts their camera settings to their environment.   Whether the content warrants taking the credit or not is case by case.  


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#17 Bruce Greene

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Posted 29 July 2016 - 12:35 PM

My most recent credit:

 

 

8BDcredit.jpg

 

I think it translates to "Chief Operator" :)


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