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YouTube ad boycott. Thoughts?


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#1 George Ebersole

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Posted 14 April 2017 - 01:45 PM

So, recently I've heard that a lot of companies have pulled ads of various forms from YouTube because of advertisers fear and dislike of their ads popping up on socially unacceptable videos; terrorist oriented or racist videos or other socially unacceptable media.  

 

There appears to be a lot of outcry about it by people who rely on YouTube as their income stream.  I'm sorry this happened, but maybe I'm heartless, but I actually do see the advertisers POV here.

 

I'm wondering if anyone here has any thoughts on the matter, and whether my perspective is not sympathetic enough.


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#2 Tyler Purcell

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Posted 14 April 2017 - 02:06 PM

Well, google/youtube advertisers are nobodies main income stream. When you do the math, the numbers you need to make money off standard youtube advertising are insane. Sure, the top 15 youtubers can make a few grand a month, but the rest of us saps can't. So the whole idea of some big companies pulling advertising from youtube, doesn't phase me or anyone else I know.

The vast majority of money to be made on youtube is through product placement and in-video advertising. The numbers are quite staggering when you start doing them. You can make upwards of a few grand per video, if you only have 100k hits. Of course, you have to pre-plan everything and have an agent who helps put the deals together, but if you're a professional youtuber, it's all doable.

I'm actually starting a youtube business very soon, I'll be launching in September if everything goes well. I've learned A LOT about youtube and how it works since I started this venture and there is a lot of money to be had, IF you make the right content.
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#3 George Ebersole

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Posted 14 April 2017 - 03:19 PM

Well, google/youtube advertisers are nobodies main income stream. When you do the math, the numbers you need to make money off standard youtube advertising are insane. Sure, the top 15 youtubers can make a few grand a month, but the rest of us saps can't. So the whole idea of some big companies pulling advertising from youtube, doesn't phase me or anyone else I know.

The vast majority of money to be made on youtube is through product placement and in-video advertising. The numbers are quite staggering when you start doing them. You can make upwards of a few grand per video, if you only have 100k hits. Of course, you have to pre-plan everything and have an agent who helps put the deals together, but if you're a professional youtuber, it's all doable.

I'm actually starting a youtube business very soon, I'll be launching in September if everything goes well. I've learned A LOT about youtube and how it works since I started this venture and there is a lot of money to be had, IF you make the right content.

 

Well, that's sort of my thought.  Way back when, when I was first starting out, here in the Bay Area at the time, you needed a financial buffer to keep freelancing, or some side gig like ... writing articles for a local paper or something, or rooming with a dozen other people like one of my former supervisors used to do in downtown San Francisco.  

 

Now work seems to be a bit more lucrative, but even so you really need to be on your game to make a living in media.  

 

I posted this here because I saw one guy crying foul over it, and looked at some related videos ... and just wasn't sure what to make of it.  To me, and maybe I'm being naive, but it seems like if you want to "create on online TV station", then you wouldn't rely solely on YouTube, but have your own site, as well as a channel on Vimeo, YouTube, and whoever else to show your stuff.

 

Most of the people here are crew, so maybe this doesn't effect them too much, but for the crew people who are also content creators, again maybe I'm callous to this, but it seems like there'd be more common sense to find other income and not just rely on one website.

 

Thanks Tyler.  Best of luck to you.


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#4 Macks Fiiod

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Posted 14 April 2017 - 03:24 PM

As (I think the only) someone here who's started from Youtube, I will be very happy to see the site collapse. Or all copyright infringing content to be banned regardless of a user's status. That second one would make the site a true meritocracy of entertainer's skill, no longer needing to use an IP for people to notice.


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#5 Tyler Purcell

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Posted 14 April 2017 - 07:52 PM

I mean you can't stop copyright infringement entirely, it's impossible. People have been doing it forever and it's just part of the world we live in. What Youtube CAN do is not allow any two frames of the same content to be posted anywhere else on the site. So if you make a video, if you post that video, nobody else can. They do this already, but the system doesn't really work in that way. I've had to pull down countless videos from youtube and it's a pain, they also get posted back up again right away. 

 

Any site that does stop people from posting copyrighted material, will be a failure. This is because most people aren't that creative and lets just be honest with ourselves, most of youtube is full of those crappy videos people throw together full of copyrighted content. If everyone had to go out and make 100% original content, both image and audio, very few people would bother and the site would fail almost immediately. It's kind of a catch 22 and it's why we don't see my idea of not being able to post 2 of the same frames, a reality. They can do it, but they don't do it because it would absolutely obliterate the site. 

 

So yea... love the idea for content makers like myself who care about those things and take pride in making original content, but how many are we? 5%? Maybe less? :shrug: 


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#6 George Ebersole

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Posted 15 April 2017 - 12:07 AM

Well, from what little I gather the ad boycott seems more related to socially unacceptable material, and has little to do with copyright.  The advertisers are concerned over people creating racist, sexist or hate based messages and their ads being tacked onto those videos.  I'm not sure why you're adding copyright to the discussion.

 

I don't know how revenue sharing works with YouTube, but to me it seems like making YouTube videos for money and as a primary source of income seems a little dicey.  It's like ... making a local show pre-net, and hoping one of the local UHF or public access channels will flip the bill for it and pay you so you can do it as a career.


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#7 Richard Boddington

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Posted 17 April 2017 - 07:44 AM

One reason Youtube should face a boycott is because those a-holes continue to allow people to upload movies!!!!

 

Then they make it the responsibility of the rights holder to prove the content belongs to them, then when they finally do take down the the video, do they suspend the account of the uploader? NOPE, said person goes merrily on their way and just does it again!!!!

 

R,


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#8 Robin R Probyn

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Posted 17 April 2017 - 08:20 AM

One reason Youtube should face a boycott is because those a-holes continue to allow people to upload movies!!!!

 

Then they make it the responsibility of the rights holder to prove the content belongs to them, then when they finally do take down the the video, do they suspend the account of the uploader? NOPE, said person goes merrily on their way and just does it again!!!!

 

R,

 

 

Vimeo has a 3 strikes and they close your account.. from the opposite side.. I had a very small clip from a program I had shot on my show reel.. and then an email from Vimeo saying I had lost one strike !.. without them ever asking me about the footage.. as some BOT had found it and reported it I guess.. in the end I got my strike re instated ..but they just went ahead without any contact with me before taking down the footage.. 


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#9 aapo lettinen

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Posted 17 April 2017 - 12:09 PM

One reason Youtube should face a boycott is because those a-holes continue to allow people to upload movies!!!!
 
Then they make it the responsibility of the rights holder to prove the content belongs to them, then when they finally do take down the the video, do they suspend the account of the uploader? NOPE, said person goes merrily on their way and just does it again!!!!
 
R,

I have never seen a hollywood or other western made movie really uploaded to youtube, those are all Full Movie Scams by either the distributor's marketing department or by some instance trying to spread malware or other harmful material. Some mosfilm stuff I have seen there which is a good thing if the movie is one of the old ones which are not legally distributed anywhere in any form..

As for the ad content, most of the youtube (and tv) ads are so insanely stupid that they are able to cause permanent brain damage so it is only a good thing if they can reduce the advertising even a little bit. Also taking into account that the persons ripping off copyrighted material and making versions and compilations of it will also get their share of the ad profits which is very wrong in all regards :o
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#10 Richard Boddington

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Posted 17 April 2017 - 02:58 PM

I have never seen a hollywood or other western made movie really uploaded to youtube, 

 

 

Waaaaaaa?  There are thousands, what YouTube are you looking at?

 

R,


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#11 David Mullen ASC

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Posted 17 April 2017 - 03:20 PM

https://m.youtube.co...h?v=0JPnR7C8mZQ
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#12 aapo lettinen

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Posted 17 April 2017 - 03:34 PM

oh now I found couple. they seem to appear and disappear every now and then, last time I checked was some time ago and there was only fullmoviescams visible. as said the only way it would be acceptable to upload these would be if it's impossible to watch the movie any other way, like for example some old Soviet films which are not distributed anymore in any form. 

 

maybe it would be wise to develop a rental option in youtube so that the distributors would get some return from these illegal uploads if it seems to be impossible to completely avoid them. another option would be to insert lots of ads to it just like they are doing with the uploaded music. this would work for the older films which are not actively distributed anyway except for VOD. for new films the best approach would still be to just remove them as quickly as possible to avoid financial losses :o


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#13 Macks Fiiod

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Posted 17 April 2017 - 04:29 PM

There are 2 stages of claims, the primary claim is easy for the owner of content. If the violating uploader counter-claims (which they need zero proof to do) the content owner has to submit legal documents with intent to go to court over it to get it taken down again, which I find ridiculous.

 

Stuff of mine has been reuploaded many many times and Youtube has little to no human element assisting in the claims. I once heard there are only 3 people running the entire claims department. You can submit full evidence that the original content is yours (aside from a lawsuit) and they'll completely ignore it.

 

Now as for FULL movies, smaller productions I see up from time to time, however any picture relevant in the modern culture of American cinema are taken down instantly.


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#14 Richard Boddington

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 01:28 AM

I have sent notices to have one of my films taken down over 40 times.

 

R,


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#15 Macks Fiiod

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 02:16 AM

Never been counter-claimed once? That's the REAL annoying part.


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#16 George Ebersole

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 04:13 AM

I have never seen a hollywood or other western made movie really uploaded to youtube, those are all Full Movie Scams by either the distributor's marketing department or by some instance trying to spread malware or other harmful material. Some mosfilm stuff I have seen there which is a good thing if the movie is one of the old ones which are not legally distributed anywhere in any form..

As for the ad content, most of the youtube (and tv) ads are so insanely stupid that they are able to cause permanent brain damage so it is only a good thing if they can reduce the advertising even a little bit. Also taking into account that the persons ripping off copyrighted material and making versions and compilations of it will also get their share of the ad profits which is very wrong in all regards :o

 

Then you haven't been using YouTube long enough.  I've seen lots of pages that have full length feature films loaded, but no, I don't watch them ... maybe one or two, and only because I owned them on disk or they weren't available.  

 

Every time I've tried to report an obvious illegal upload (say original "Star Wars" as an example) you have to be the owner in order to file a violation with YouTube.

 

And I think that's cause enough for the boycott.  

 

However, it tells me that the ad process is automated.  Pre-net the advertisers checked the property or show they were advertising on, and sometimes turned a blind eye if it was marginally objectionable, but then either avoided said material or contacted the station manager or studio heads.

 

To me it just says that YouTube ads should probably cost more, and companies that want to advertise should be more careful about from whoever they're buying ad space.  

 

I'm sorry to hear it's happened to legitimate YouTube types, but it's like that websites a zoo with illegal uploads, and people pirating content from other users.


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#17 George Ebersole

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 04:19 AM

There are 2 stages of claims, the primary claim is easy for the owner of content. If the violating uploader counter-claims (which they need zero proof to do) the content owner has to submit legal documents with intent to go to court over it to get it taken down again, which I find ridiculous.

 

Stuff of mine has been reuploaded many many times and Youtube has little to no human element assisting in the claims. I once heard there are only 3 people running the entire claims department. You can submit full evidence that the original content is yours (aside from a lawsuit) and they'll completely ignore it.

 

Now as for FULL movies, smaller productions I see up from time to time, however any picture relevant in the modern culture of American cinema are taken down instantly.

 

There's a Carl's Junior that I occasionally hit in San Bruno that's across the street from YouTube's HQ.  On Fridays the company throws a bash with a live band for the employees.  

 

One wonders where their priorities are.


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#18 Macks Fiiod

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 02:27 PM

 

There's a Carl's Junior that I occasionally hit in San Bruno that's across the street from YouTube's HQ.  On Fridays the company throws a bash with a live band for the employees.  

 

One wonders where their priorities are.

That sounds like very standard silicon valley entitlement.


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#19 George Ebersole

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 12:33 AM

Maybe.  I won't name drop, but the guys I grew up with coded and made sure their customers were satisfied.  I'm thinking YouTube is relying more and more on automated processing like a lot of other websites that offer services.

 

I was actually going to advertise on YouTube last year and year before, but not now.  Their policing of their own site is pretty lax.  I think a lot of it is from the "offer it for free" business model.  Which means where they attract new users to boost their base, the return on that base doesn't offset the cost of hiring more personnel to police things like piracy and jihadist crap.  

 

But they throw a bash every Friday to keep the troops happy.  Go figure. ... with barbcue.  You can see and smell the smoke/steam sometimes.


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#20 Macks Fiiod

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 02:20 AM

Yeah, also no telling whether your ads will end up on a neo nazi's video game rant.


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