Jump to content


Photo

XDCam clips metadata - Help!

SxS metadata

  • Please log in to reply
20 replies to this topic

#1 Jimmy Jib

Jimmy Jib
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 45 posts
  • Other
  • Australia

Posted 02 May 2017 - 10:26 AM

I recently upgraded to a PIX-E5 for my Sony F3, but I still use SxS cards as a back up ( and plan to do so in the future ). Only problem is, I am not able to access one of the most valuable features of XDCam: clips metadata. None of the Sony programs have allowed me to view metadata info off the clips. By this I mean things like:  AE Mode, Gamma, Gain, Shutter, ND Filter, Rec Mode, WB Preset, FStop, Shot Marks, OK Marks,  etc. I think XDCam metadata even lets you write comments and other data on the clips ( in cam ).
I am also losing the ability to create subclips ! Again, none of the programs I have tried makes it clear that they can do this.
I think I have tried most of the programs Sony has released for XDCam :

XDCam EX Clip Browser V 2.6 ( only compatible with early F3s, mine has the 4444 RGB upgrade )
Content Browser V.2.4 ( no metadata access at all here and they expect me to pay $20 for the full version? )
Catalyst Browse ( very nice slick browser here, but ... where's the metadata? I don't want color correction features, I want XDCam metadata!! No subclip creation support here also. )

I come from using Panasonic cameras before and I am relatively new to XDCam, but I will say I never had any of these problems with P2 metadata! Their content browsers work with old P2 cameras as well as new! And they are free to download and use too! Sony's software does not even work as expected and they want to charge me money for it? Okay, so you can tell I am not happy about this, believe me, I do not give up easily... but Sony is really testing my patience by also ignoring my requests for support. I have waited for almost 2 weeks to hear from them in regards to these matters and still no reply!! Only default automated message "we will answer your question soon" !
Okay, well hopefully this forum can help.

Thanks in advance!
 


  • 0


Support Cinematography.com and buy gear using our Amazon links!
PANASONIC LUMIX GH5 Body 4K Mirrorless Camera, 20.3 Megapixels, Dual I.S. 2.0, 4K 422 10-bit, Full Size HDMI Out, 3 Inch Touch LCD, DC-GH5KBODY (USA Black)

#2 Jimmy Jib

Jimmy Jib
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 45 posts
  • Other
  • Australia

Posted 04 May 2017 - 01:46 PM

" We will answer your question soon " ?  <_<


  • 0

#3 Robin R Probyn

Robin R Probyn
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1594 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Tokyo

Posted 04 May 2017 - 08:04 PM

I use Cat Browse (free version) for playback without any problems.. metadata all there.. far right window..all the other programs my mention are old and discontinued .. are you sure you have that main "window" configured to show MD.. should be far right under a small preview window.. sorry I have never found a way to post pics or screen grabs here..!!

 

Are you saying the files from the SxS cards.. or from the PIX.. they are proRes..  ?


  • 0

#4 Jimmy Jib

Jimmy Jib
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 45 posts
  • Other
  • Australia

Posted 05 May 2017 - 05:50 AM

Hey Robin. I'm referring to the files from the SxS card. The clips from the PIX-E5 are all ProRes files.  My SxS is only used as a back up, as they are 8 bit 4:2:0 clips. Nevertheless, SxS are still super reliable and very useful when you have access to all the metadata and functions.

I took a screen cap of Catalyst Browser to look at the Metadata window . Yes it's all there, but I still see a lot of metadata missing. Things like what I mentioned before: AE Mode, Gamma, Gain, Shutter, ND Filter, WB Preset, FStop, Shot Marks, OK Marks,  Comments. In some cases even Lens Info was available from  the metadata ( only with some lenses ). Where is all that metadata? Have a closer look and tell me if you see it anywhere there :

http://vzaar.tv/10096175


P.S. You may need to expand the clip to full screen. Under Acquisition Metadata, there are only two parameters: Recording mode and Cache Rec.  There should be many more!!

 


Edited by Jimmy Jib, 05 May 2017 - 05:58 AM.

  • 0

#5 Jimmy Jib

Jimmy Jib
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 45 posts
  • Other
  • Australia

Posted 05 May 2017 - 06:23 AM

Okay,  it seems "Comments" ( Title, Creator, Description ) are available under "Logging". You also have to "Unlock" the fields if you want to edit it. But I'm still not finding other acquisition metadata there like Gain and Gamma. Under Picture Profile Set ( on the F3 ) there is even more metadata info that I don't find anywhere here... Does this info have to be manually "saved" on the SxS for it to be viewable from Catalyst Browser?


  • 0

#6 Robin R Probyn

Robin R Probyn
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1594 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Tokyo

Posted 05 May 2017 - 06:59 AM

No manual saving needed.. I get all the lens info etc.. maybe depends on the lens of course ..I have Canon CN7 which talks to the camera though the C(cooke) type lens interface pins.. sorry Im not an expert with Cat browse.. I just use it for playback really.. 

The only thing I can think is that your using an F3.. and that cat browse is not seeing your info due to older firmware.. what works with the F3.. ?  f5/55 is now V8.1.. most likely the new Sony software is not giving you everything due to the older firmware of the F3..? the F5/55 dont have any picture profiles.. they are now only on the "lower" end camera s..


Edited by Robin R Probyn, 05 May 2017 - 07:03 AM.

  • 0

#7 Jimmy Jib

Jimmy Jib
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 45 posts
  • Other
  • Australia

Posted 05 May 2017 - 07:54 AM

Bummer. Never had these kind of limitations with Panasonic P2 Browsers.              
XDCam EX Clip Browser V 2.6 was supposed to work with the F3, but once I updated to the latest firmware ( I can record to 10 bit ProRes 4444 XQ now ), my F3 became unsupported by XDCam EX Clip Browser.  So it seems my F3 is " too new "  for XDCam EX Clip Browser and " too old " for Catalyst Browser ? <_<


  • 0

#8 Robin R Probyn

Robin R Probyn
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1594 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Tokyo

Posted 05 May 2017 - 08:12 AM

Maybe falls between two chairs.. I guess Sony support.. if they ever pull their finger out.. should be the ones to give the best advise ..


  • 0

#9 Jimmy Jib

Jimmy Jib
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 45 posts
  • Other
  • Australia

Posted 05 May 2017 - 08:44 AM

 Sony reps ever post on this forum? On dvx-user they have a Panasonic Rep answering questions sometimes.


  • 0

#10 Robin R Probyn

Robin R Probyn
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1594 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Tokyo

Posted 05 May 2017 - 09:18 AM

 Sony reps ever post on this forum? On dvx-user they have a Panasonic Rep answering questions sometimes.

 

 

Not that I know of.. have you tried the Sony US backed forums online.. there is one for F5/55 and one for Fs7.. alot of good info on those and some F3 users I believe.. there are also quite a few second hand f5/55,s that come up FS too.. 


  • 0

#11 Jimmy Jib

Jimmy Jib
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 45 posts
  • Other
  • Australia

Posted 05 May 2017 - 01:38 PM

I've tried the Sony Facebook forums, unfortunately not a lot of discussion going on there.


  • 0

#12 Jimmy Jib

Jimmy Jib
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 45 posts
  • Other
  • Australia

Posted 05 May 2017 - 03:20 PM

 What is the correct way to create a sub-clip in Catalyst Browser? I tried Mark In / Out points, then Export and it rendered the subclip but ended up with a low resolution crap version of the original clip. Not at all what I wanted.


  • 0

#13 Robin R Probyn

Robin R Probyn
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1594 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Tokyo

Posted 05 May 2017 - 07:46 PM

Sorry dont know.. only use it for playback.. here is a link to the "official" Sony forum .. you have to register to post.. but you could use the search function I think..

 

http://community.son...r-camera-F5-F55


  • 0

#14 Jimmy Jib

Jimmy Jib
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 45 posts
  • Other
  • Australia

Posted 06 May 2017 - 11:42 AM

Thanks Robin. Well it seems the best way to create a subclip is to go into Catalyst Prepare. I am impressed with the results I got here, and the ease of use.  Acquisition Metadata was still missing though, and it seems there is indeed a lack of support for cameras like the PMW-F3. This reason alone may put me off paying the annual fee for this software.


  • 0

#15 Robin R Probyn

Robin R Probyn
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1594 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Tokyo

Posted 06 May 2017 - 07:43 PM

Or you could up date to a Fs7 or F5 :)... I only used the F3 once.. the F5 is a marked improvement .. some cheap second hand ones around now too.. come up on the forum often.. 

 

Yes Cat B is the free software.. then you pay for the prep.. think there are a few others too.. they seem to be concentrating in this area now more than actual hardware.. if NAB is anything to go by.. alot of back end stuff.. and only one new EVF and a card reader :)..

 

That forum is a pretty good resource  ..and Alister Chapmans site.. for all things Sony..


  • 0

#16 Jimmy Jib

Jimmy Jib
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 45 posts
  • Other
  • Australia

Posted 07 May 2017 - 02:41 PM

The F3 is still very capable. Once you have the CBK-RGB01 upgrade installed and the PIX-E5 setup, your "outdated" Cinealta becomes 10 bit ProRes 4444 XQ capable... and some of the other recorders can even let you get uncompressed dpx out of it. I don't think enough people got to play with these features because there's new cameras coming out all the time and people want to believe they can "future proof" themselves by buying the latest. Here in Australia most TV channels are still SD, and Blu-Rays are still not out-selling DVDs... so I don't see a need for 4K. Besides that, the F5 is listed on B&H as a $16,490.00  cam... roughly what the F3 was worth when it was first released.
 


  • 0

#17 Robin R Probyn

Robin R Probyn
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1594 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Tokyo

Posted 07 May 2017 - 08:20 PM

Yes F3 is still firing Im sure.. but for usability . the F5 is undoubtedly an advancement .. as of course it should be going out after the F3.. just had a play with the variable ND on a Fs7 MkII.. great feature.. total control over your DoF.. this alone would make me buy a new F6 or what ever is coming.. Im not sure if Sony have a Patient on this .. but its a big step forward for digital cameras.. and would  I think a major selling point.. or maybe its just me thats thinks its thing since sliced bread..


  • 0

#18 Jimmy Jib

Jimmy Jib
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 45 posts
  • Other
  • Australia

Posted 15 May 2017 - 12:40 PM

Sony support never answered my question!! Nearly one month has gone by!!   Shame on you Sony... other companies answer questions within 24 hours...  sometimes even within minutes if you're lucky! ( Convergent Design ) The fact Sony Reps don't even get involved on this section of the forum speaks volumes of the commitment they have to their loyal customers, most of whom have spent a small fortune on their products.
 


  • 0

#19 Robin R Probyn

Robin R Probyn
  • Basic Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1594 posts
  • Cinematographer
  • Tokyo

Posted 15 May 2017 - 06:57 PM

Dont take it personally ..Sony support is legendary is their uselessness .. very decent cameras but their support is well known to be the worst.. I called them all day in Singapore and no one even answered the phone.. !.. in Tokyo a Sony engineer denied out a hand a very well known problem.. that Sony Europe was even offering a free replacement at the same time..!!  total shambles .. refused to give me his name even.. 

 

The only support will be from the Sony forums from other members .. 


  • 0

#20 Jimmy Jib

Jimmy Jib
  • Basic Members
  • PipPip
  • 45 posts
  • Other
  • Australia

Posted 01 June 2017 - 02:56 PM

SONY replies!! An update may follow...

CatalystA.jpg





 


  • 0



Rig Wheels Passport

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

Paralinx LLC

Gamma Ray Digital Inc

Willys Widgets

Ritter Battery

Technodolly

Visual Products

The Slider

rebotnix Technologies

Broadcast Solutions Inc

Abel Cine

FJS International, LLC

Aerial Filmworks

Glidecam

CineTape

Metropolis Post

CineLab

Tai Audio

Paralinx LLC

CineTape

Tai Audio

Technodolly

Ritter Battery

Abel Cine

Gamma Ray Digital Inc

The Slider

Glidecam

rebotnix Technologies

Visual Products

Aerial Filmworks

CineLab

Metropolis Post

Rig Wheels Passport

Broadcast Solutions Inc

FJS International, LLC

Willys Widgets

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS