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Any experience with Chinese Fresnels?


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#41 Samuel Berger

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Posted 03 November 2017 - 07:25 PM

I wish companies would stop messing with the colours.

 

I went to look for "Les Ripoux" which has sort of the look that I want and apparently it's been re-graded to this:

 

ripoux-07-g.jpg

 

 

 

It's supposed to look like this:

 

ripoux.jpg

 

So best way is to post a Youtube link:

 

 

 


Edited by Samuel Berger, 03 November 2017 - 07:29 PM.

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#42 Samuel Berger

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 10:21 PM

the main issue with tungsten lights is the colour temperature, if you want a cold look with daylight film it is best to use high colour temperature to help exposing the emulsion layers for lower grain (otherwise would be no benefit of using the low sensitivity stock) and to be able to get the correct exposure for the look as well (better to boost the blue channel to the right exposure level on set rather than underexposing it and gaining it in post) , but that means you would need to gel the tungsten lights to maybe around 7000K or so and the gels then eat up so much light that you need really powerful tungstens to use the 50D film you have on a larger set (meaning that you would like to light an area wider than couple of feets/maybe 1.5 - 2 meters at a time). 

 

The HMIs have both much better efficiency (about 4x more light per watt than with tungsten lights) and they are already somewhere around 6000K native so you don't have to gel them as much. 

if doing a very unscientific "calculation" you would get maybe something like 8x - 9x more light with the HMI compared to similar wattage tungsten light if gelling the tungsten to the same high colour temp? 

So the 1.2k hmi compares to at least 10K tungsten light in your application, maybe more if you compare the reflectors and spread ("punch") as well if the tungsten is fresnel and the HMI is a new par or Max model. 

 

Your power options are probably limited so I really don't think you are really able to replace a hmi with any kind of tungsten in your application, you will just limit your set size so much that it makes shooting difficult and you have to use mostly tight shots and light a very small area at a time to be able to get the exposure you need for the very insensitive film. with 250D it would be not that much of a problem or with 200T not at all but with the 50 it certainly is. 

I personally use the 2k tungstens for cold look on limited budget only if the camera can do 1000 - 1600 ISO or more so that gelling is possible and I can still light an area wider than couple of meters at a time. otherwise it would be HMI of at least one or two 1.2K's or more, preferably 1.8K's or 2.5K's (those still can use household power here in 230V country) or with that insensitive film I would maybe use two 4K's or one 4K and one 1.8K so that could light a slightly larger area at a time and don't have to shoot wide open all the time.

 

Of course if lighting very tight shots at a time, shooting wide open and limiting the actor movement to an area not exceeding couple of feets at a time, then some smaller tungstens would do. Could be best, however, if you could use a 200T film if limited to tungsten lights so that you would not need as much gelling than with a daylight film, you will lose about two stops on the gels so you will effectively waste about 3/4 of the intensity of the light. added with the low efficiency of tungsten lights the 2K's or 5K's are very small in your application but of course you can use them (on a small area at a time) if not having any better option available ;)  

 

Having trouble finding items that aren't either way too expensive or Chinese knock offs. I take it that Source Four Pars and HMI Pars aren't the same thing. The price difference is huge.

(I've only ever lit interviews)


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#43 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 07 November 2017 - 11:23 PM

Source Four is a brand name, that's all, but the Pars that Phil was referring to are tungsten. HMI pars have the same design, but are daylight discharge lamps which require expensive globes and ballasts, hence the price difference.

 

if you don't like the idea of chinese copies, you could try looking at craigslist for used Mole Rchardson lamps. I'm not a big fan myself, but they can often be found at reasonable prices. You could also try https://www.usedlighting.com/

 

Remember, you are limited to about 1.8kw from a normal domestic outlet in the US, and sometimes less if the wiring and switchgear is old


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#44 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 08 November 2017 - 03:54 AM

HMI Source Four PARs do exist, usually at 575W, and are very powerful for their wattage.


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#45 Samuel Berger

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 12:38 PM

So back to the original subject, it looks like the Chinese have updated their knockoffs a little.

https://www.ebay.com...lb/332204394990
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