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#1 J. Lamar King

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Posted 08 July 2005 - 10:11 PM

Just curious at what laptops you guys use? I am looking into getting one to use for pre-viz, look management and signal test software etc. I'm really interested in the Apple Powerbook, I really like that small one.
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#2 Richard Boddington

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Posted 08 July 2005 - 10:45 PM

Here's some thing to consider, in TV shows and movies the bad guys always use PC lap taps, the good guys always use Mac. I saw an article on this, very interesting.

I've been a Mac user since 84 so I'm biased, but the Mac power books running OSX are solid machines, you can't go wrong. Buy one from a local Mac store, usually they'll go to the ends of the earth to make sure you're happy.

A huge contrast to buying a PC laptop from a pimple faced kid at Circuit City, or worse, over the phone with Dell.

Plus you'll be protected from the mass of viruses out there. My friends who use PCs spend so much time trying to get the viruses out of those things. I knowingly try and open strange attachments in my e-mail, my Mac just laughs at them, they can't hurt the Mac.

And now I'm sure the PC side will chime in with their response :D

R,
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#3 Robert Hughes

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Posted 08 July 2005 - 11:10 PM

Get a laptop that is large enough to do useful work on. The little 12" screen Macs are too small for my taste. I work almost exclusively with PC's, but my all-time favorite laptop was a black Apple Powerbook G3 running OS9 (until my wife poured a cup of coffee into it). Macs are overpriced compared to the equivalent PC notebooks. OS9 and OS X are completely different beasts; decide which one you need and avoid the other.

Unless you are a network security wizard, Windows of any flavor is a virus attack waiting to happen. And Dell support is as bad as the voicemail hell they put you thru to get to it. Avoid both if you can.

Linux and BSD run on PC's or Powerbooks, and have become capable enough to be useful in a variety of places. But then you are using Open Source equivalents of standard apps (some are very good), and if you aren't a Unix geek you'll have a bit of a learning curve to become one. I'm working on an OpenBSD box now; it's my main link to the Internet, runs my home network firewall, and I've never had a virus on this network.

But any modern machine will probably do what you want it to do, if you find the software you need and buy the machine and OS that supports it.
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#4 Tenolian Bell

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Posted 09 July 2005 - 10:43 AM

I use a Power Book.

Pretty much you would need to explore what all will you do with your lap top, and which workflow is best for you.

I can agree with the crappy service at the local retail store. I stopped by a new Best Buy in the Village in New York. I heard this student tell the salesman he wanted a lap top for graphic design.

The salesman immidiately went straight to price. He showed the guy a lap top for $500, and began talking about pricing plans, and how you earn money back for your purchase.

But no talk about how this lap top is good for graphic design.

Oh also it should be pretty much impossible to buy a Mac at this point running OS9.

Edited by tenobell, 09 July 2005 - 10:45 AM.

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#5 Sam Wells

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Posted 09 July 2005 - 11:27 AM

No question you get more processing power per $ from a Wintel PC. But.

(One reason Apple is switching to the Intel chip, notice there are no G5 Powerbooks due to the heat issues).

OTOH Powerbooks are a great to use. Mine has crashed (ie needing a reboot) exactly twice in 2 years of almost daily use. No virus etc issues. (Of course aplications can crash on anything).

The display is the best !

Go with the 15" over the 12"

-Sam
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#6 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 09 July 2005 - 12:31 PM

i've got a G4 Powerbook. Barring a few issues with OSX when it first arrived, it's been solid ever since. I run FCP & Photoshop on it, as well as Speedgrade.

although Apple is about to switch to Intel chips, I think it will still be a long while before a Intel Powerbook is available, so it's worth getting the highest spec G4 that you can.

Edited by Stuart Brereton, 09 July 2005 - 12:32 PM.

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#7 Tenolian Bell

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Posted 09 July 2005 - 01:21 PM

IBM could deliver a G5 for the Power Book if they wanted. But R&D were pointed at winning the gaming console platform.

Apple switching to Intel will bring the immediacy of faster processors clock wise, but has disadvantages to Power PC in other ways.

Intel to some degree is constrained to making its chips for mass vendors, and leaves little room for experimentation and a long time for adoption of innovation.

With Apple as a partner should free them with faster adoption of innovation that will filter to the wider vendors.

Intel inside a Mac won't be available until June 2006. I wouldn't count on Intel being in Power Mac's or Power Book's until 2007.

So if you need one now, you should buy it now.
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#8 Kai.w

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Posted 09 July 2005 - 02:09 PM

Lots of apple users here ... :D

Ok, just to give sme balance to this. I work with IRIX/Linux/OSX/WIN on a daily basis.
Most of the people I know have powerbooks, but they need it primarily for final cut or other typical mac apps.
I personally think that still IBM builds the best notebooks. They are rocksolid, suberbly built and have great support and the Pentium M beats the hell out of the G4s. Plus I like the more technical yet classic design.
As for the Viruses... its an issue on windows (not on linux) but its not as dramatic as it seems. Do a regular windowsUpdate plus regular virusscanner updates and take a little care about opening apps from dubious sources and you should go fine.

In the end I'd say make your decision based on what software you want to use primarily. Then check on which platform you'd get the best for these applications.
What should be the size? Ultraportable or more of a somewhat mobile desktop replacement...? How important is batterylife? Will you do CPU intensive stuff or more lightweight office work. All these are factors need to be taken into account.

Two or three years ago Powerbooks would have been the only computers by Apple that I'd really recommend, cause of low battery usage and reasonable performance. Since the Pentium M this has completely changed and its quite obvious that Apple has fallen behind in the notebook sector (but gained quite something in the desktop sector).

-k (who has fallen into a river during shooting some previz, with his loved X31 thinkpad in a bag on his back; but apart from the battery nothing broke)
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#9 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 09 July 2005 - 02:26 PM

Hi,

The best displays, particularly on the Vaio series which can boast really quite decent contrast ratio, are on PC laptops. I looked closely at a Mac, but the only advantage was size and battery life.

You've really got to be pretty dim to be hit by a virus on any platform.

Phil
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#10 Sam Wells

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Posted 09 July 2005 - 03:01 PM

I'll still take the Apple LCD oved the Vaio (which is the best I've seen on PC laptops).

I'd be surprised if Apple didn't make the Powerbooks w/ Intel a priority though.

-Sam
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#11 Tenolian Bell

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Posted 09 July 2005 - 07:34 PM

I'd be surprised if Apple didn't make the Powerbooks w/ Intel a priority though.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


I'm sure Apple will want to update PowerBook's as quickly as possible.

But they are now under Intel's design road map. Intel releases the same chips to everyone at the same time.

Will Intel have the chips Apple will want for the PowerBook's available by June 2006? We really don't know.

Intel is making some radical design changes in its chips next year, and the chip everyone thinks Apple would use in PowerBook's won't be available from Intel's roadmap until late 2006.
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#12 J. Lamar King

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Posted 09 July 2005 - 09:18 PM

Is this chip change really going to have that big of an effect? Wouldn't Intel be building what is in effect the same chip? As in Company A made widget chip X now Company B makes widget chip X?
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#13 Elhanan Matos

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Posted 09 July 2005 - 10:19 PM

I'm going to try to hold back on the whole Mac VS. PC thing for right now, It's my absolute favorite argument to get into.

I just want to settle this whole Virus thing. If you're using windows XP SP2 all you have to do is turn on the auto update feature, turn on the windows firewall (having a hardware firewall is a good thing too) then don't download any attachments from anyone unless you are expecting something from someone, don't use Microsoft Outlook, Use Mozilla Thunderbird, Don't use Internet Explorer, Use Mozilla Firefox (www.getfirefox.com), and finally be smart about what websites you go to and what you download (ie only go to trusted porn sites).

And about windows crashing... It's a thing of the past. I have been running Windows XP on my current computer for about one year now and It hasn't crashed once yet.
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#14 Tenolian Bell

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Posted 09 July 2005 - 10:36 PM

Is this chip change really going to have that big of an effect?  Wouldn't Intel be building what is in effect the same chip?  As in Company A made widget chip X now Company B makes widget chip X?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


IBM, Intel, and AMD all use different chip designs, and over time their own designs change year after year.
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#15 Richard Boddington

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Posted 09 July 2005 - 11:55 PM

"I just want to settle this whole Virus thing. If you're using windows XP SP2 all you have to do is turn on the auto update feature, turn on the windows firewall (having a hardware firewall is a good thing too) then don't download any attachments from anyone unless you are expecting something from someone, don't use Microsoft Outlook, Use Mozilla Thunderbird, Don't use Internet Explorer, Use Mozilla Firefox (www.getfirefox.com), and finally be smart about what websites you go to and what you download"

Good bloody grief!!! This is the strongest argument to date on why a person SHOULD buy a Mac!

If the above is true what can you do with a PC besides use it as a boat anchor???

I never worry about any of that BS, geez buy a Mac.

R,
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#16 Elhanan Matos

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Posted 10 July 2005 - 12:11 AM

I never worry about any of that BS, geez buy a Mac.


I don't worry either, when you use any of the Mozilla products you don't have to worry. I also don't have to get a second mortgage to buy a piece of hardware that I won't be able to upgrade... but hey... you do get those little bouncy icons.

I'll just leave it with this... when you go to the computer store to buy software how many different choices do you have?
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#17 Remi Adefarasin

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Posted 10 July 2005 - 06:38 AM

I have to say I agree with Elhanan Matos. Everything is very expensive in England so it's PC for me. Cheaper, very powerful, & a multitude of programs.
Using a Toshiba widescreen M30 with XP SP2. I installed the free Zonealarm & AntiVir and not a single problem.

Remi
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#18 Mark Allen

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Posted 10 July 2005 - 01:11 PM

oh... guess I have to add my two cents.

I've switched a lot of people over from PC to Mac. A lot. At my company two people have to use both systems (because some XSI only runs on PC) - but unless they are running that application - they are using their Mac. Eventhough their mac is a four year old outdated model, it's just a more pleasant environment to use. I had to be dual platform (actually triple platform because of SGI) for a while and there was no comparison.

Now - interestingly enough with the pending chip change - that will not change the osx experience at all, but what it will do is for people who need to use "that one program" now and then... they'll be able to make their computers dual boot in Mac OSX and Windows. It will not work the other way around. Only Macs will run OSX.

All this said.... If you are a gamer and buying today - buy a PC. You'll be disappointed in the mac game offerings. That is an argument I cannot fight. If you're a daytrader making live trades from home. While people do it on a mac using Virtual PC, I wouldn't risk that. And... if you are an XSI user.... can't do that on a Mac. Otherwise, life is a little easier in the mac world and all the cool things are actually working... iLife alone is huge. Things work better and you don't need a personal IT guy or a "friend who makes PCs" handy to figure out what the hell went wrong all the time.
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#19 Phil Rhodes

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Posted 10 July 2005 - 02:14 PM

Hi,

> It will not work the other way around

For the first week.

Phil
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#20 Richard Boddington

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Posted 10 July 2005 - 03:58 PM

"I also don't have to get a second mortgage to buy a piece of hardware that I won't be able to upgrade... but hey... you do get those little bouncy icons.
I'll just leave it with this... when you go to the computer store to buy software how many different choices do you have? "

What do you mean you can't upgrade it?

As for price you get what you pay for.

As for software, if Mac or some second party doesn't make "it" for the Mac. You don't need it.

Of course encouraging more people to be Mac users will ultimately lead to the end of the very reason people want to be in the Mac community. We want to be part of the 2.5% of computer users around the world that use Mac, not the 97.5% that use PC.

R,
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