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Can You Make a Kodak 16mm magazine accept single perf?


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#1 Elie Harriett

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Posted 04 May 2018 - 07:43 PM

An introduction:  Hi!!  I'm Elie in Mansfield, Ohio.  I'm not a filmmaker, but I have an interest in very old cameras.  I recently came upon a number of old double 8 and 16mm cameras and a few super 8's, and, in addition to the working with old still film cameras, I thought I'd try and learn to use some of the 8 and 16 cameras.  I'm experimenting with the 8's already, and I want to get the 16 working for a family vacation in a couple months.

 

My question: I was disheartened to see the 16's, which require the Kodak 16 magazine, work with double perf film only.  I'd been trying to see if there is some way to modify a magazine 16 to work with single perf only.  Google and any other searches keep bringing me back here.  I found some posts of people modifying cameras, but no one has mentioned modifying the magazines yet.  Has anyone been able to successfully modify a Magazine 16 canister to work with modern 16mm films?  Will it work?  How are the results?  Can you share the instructions?

 

Thanks in advance!


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#2 Frank Wylie

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Posted 04 May 2018 - 07:55 PM

Do yourself a favor and put the magazine camera on a shelf and admire it.  Seriously, finding magazines, reloading them...; not to mention modifying the camera to take single perforation film. 

 

Nightmare.  The magazine cameras are cheap and plentiful on Ebay for a reason...

 

Besides, modify a camera in a couple of weeks?  Not likely.

 

The least expensive route to shoot 100 foot loads would be to find a Bell & Howell 240 like this one:  https://www.ebay.com...zgAAOSw~y9ZCWnx or this one:  https://www.ebay.com...5.c100005.m1851

 

The only caveat is the ones with photocell automatic exposure can be non-functional  Stick to the manual version and get a light meter.

 

Great, simple camera with a bullet proof film gate and easy to use.  (Egads, watch the shipping costs on that site!  Crazy...)

 

Just my 2 cents...


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#3 Elie Harriett

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Posted 05 May 2018 - 12:54 AM

That’s an interesting idea. There’s a battery version and a non battery version? Can I manually adjust either without power?
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#4 Charlie Peich

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Posted 05 May 2018 - 05:26 AM

This was done in 1948....

 

48_-_11_50ft_mag_loading_H.M._11_1948_-_


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#5 Elie Harriett

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Posted 05 May 2018 - 10:41 AM

Holy cats!! That would be a yes, then! I may have to make an attempt!!
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#6 Michael Carter

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Posted 06 May 2018 - 08:56 PM

Turn the gate upside down, too,
the spring thing.
http://www.retrocine...zine-reloading/
I did one myself and was not clean enough and got a scratch.
https://m.youtube.co...h?v=0W6zgzQL3tc
7266 single perf new film was used

Edited by Michael Carter, 06 May 2018 - 09:07 PM.

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#7 Elie Harriett

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Posted 25 May 2018 - 11:59 PM

Ok. I rethreaded the film that it came with like it is shown in the picture.

I am not getting the gate part or the pressure plate part. I see that there is a catch/snag somewhere. I assume this is the part attached to the lid? It appears to be riveted in, not screwed in like the cover. Do you recommend breaking the rivet? How should I reverse it? Or am I looking at the wrong part entirely.

Thanks. Highly encouraged by what I’ve done so far.
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#8 Elie Harriett

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Posted 26 May 2018 - 03:45 PM

Additionally, here's what I've been able to do so far.  The canister matches the picture perfectly.  For testing purposes, I'm using the film already in the magazine, which is double perf.  But this is what the top looks like.

 

 

Attached Images

  • IMG_4815.JPG
  • IMG_4816.JPG

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#9 Michael Carter

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Posted 26 May 2018 - 11:59 PM

Turn the footage dial inside the lid around. It is spring loaded. Hold it in place on the outside. Put the lid on and let go. It will snap to the film.
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#10 Michael Carter

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Posted 27 May 2018 - 12:01 AM

https://m.youtube.co...h?v=CbbBPEYgBDk
More video about the mags
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#11 Elie Harriett

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Posted 27 May 2018 - 02:02 AM

That is an incredible video. Thank you. I’ll give that a try tomorrow and report my results.
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#12 Elie Harriett

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Posted 27 May 2018 - 10:41 PM

Nope! I pulled the gate back and it screwed back on perfectly. Out in the mag and wound it up. Would not move when I released the catch

I changed the threading to the threading in the picture above. It DID work with the original, much more convoluted winding. But something is stopping it from moving now.

Ideas? Is there an additional modification I am missing?
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#13 Pavan Deep

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Posted 28 May 2018 - 03:17 PM

I have done what the picture above says many times now, each time with success. Are the perforations catching the camera's claw? When the magazine is closed open it's gate to see if you can see the perfs.

 

Pav


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#14 Michael Carter

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Posted 29 May 2018 - 07:39 PM

Did the footage counter work?
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#15 Elie Harriett

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Posted 29 May 2018 - 09:13 PM

Michael, the counter resets and holds when I pull it back.

 

Pavan, I'm attaching a pic, if this is what you're referring to. 

 

 

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  • IMG_4823.JPG

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#16 Pavan Deep

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Posted 29 May 2018 - 11:53 PM

Something is making the film not move. Can you make a little video showing how you loaded the film?

 

Pav


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#17 Michael Carter

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Posted 30 May 2018 - 10:16 AM

Sometimes, when inserting the magazine, the sliding gate cover button catches on the edge of the two prongs it is supposed to go inbetween, and moves back some, then, the door won't close. Also, there is a loud click when the lock is set to run.
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#18 Michael Carter

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Posted 30 May 2018 - 10:37 AM

I made some really bad videos and put them on Facebook, https://www.facebook...33878160190581/
There are 4 of them

Edited by Michael Carter, 30 May 2018 - 10:45 AM.

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#19 Elie Harriett

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Posted 30 May 2018 - 11:48 AM

Sorry for the delay.  I made a short vid, but something happened with the sound, so I'll have to remake it this evening before posting.  Stay tuned


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#20 Elie Harriett

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Posted 30 May 2018 - 05:10 PM

Uploaded!  Here you go:

 

https://youtu.be/M4NGcJFXowg


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