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#1 David Daniel Doherty

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Posted 12 June 2018 - 04:27 PM

Hi all, I hope I'm posting in the correct form.

I own a DJI Ronin M and I am now about to purchase a camera, which I would like to use with it.

My heart was set on the FS7 but there seems to be an awkward work-around to operate the FS7 on the Ronin M?

Another option is the URSA Mini Pro.

An option is to change my Ronin M for a big Ronin, but it's too heavy bla bla.

Anyone have any thoughts on a good camera option for a man who owns a Ronin M.

Budget $/EU6000

(not intersted in A7S)

Thanks. Positive, helpful replies please.
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#2 Gabriel Elder

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Posted 12 June 2018 - 07:13 PM

Hi David!

I own an FS7 and unfortunately I don't think you'll have much luck using it with the Ronin M.  The body is a little too big and it is over the max payload weight wise.

One option worth looking at would be the FS5.  It's similar in many ways to the FS7 but with a smaller form factor.   It requires some special pieces, but people have had success with it: 


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#3 Robin R Probyn

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Posted 13 June 2018 - 03:28 AM

For a gimbal fs5 would be ok.. but its a very different camera from the fs7.. and could be very limiting for work if its your only pony.. 

 

Codec is only LongGOP XAVC L.. and 4K internal Rec is only 8bit..only has Picture Profiles .. no EI mode.. etc..  and there are some limitations on monitor outs.. . there is actually quite a big difference between the fs5 and fs7..  .. what about one of the high end DSLR/Mirror less cameras for the Ronin.. G4 or A7 series .. or even A9..for the gimbal.. and fs7 can handle just about anything else..


Edited by Robin R Probyn, 13 June 2018 - 03:29 AM.

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#4 Chris Steel

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Posted 13 June 2018 - 04:14 AM

The Ronin M is really quite small. Even the FS5 can be a pain to rig if you have a bigger lens, wireless focus, scratch audio on there.

As shown in the video above, Cine Milled plate is a must. I'd also recommend the Pan weight system as well if you're using cine style lenses (even the Samyangs) with wireless focus as you'll only just get pan balance without.

 

I've seen FS5 owners use an Atomos recorder to get better quality out. That adds a bit to the price but would give you a much better monitor to operate the gimbal with on top of better image quality.


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#5 Jaron Berman

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Posted 13 June 2018 - 08:30 AM

Ursa mini is roughly the same size as FS7 body but heavier and less features.  What are you trying to shoot/what specs do you need the camera head to have?  It seems a bit backwards to start with a compact gimbal and buy a camera to fit it.  

 

FS5 is actually quite capable.  It does have cine EI (s-log3 or ) but does not have onboard LUTS beyond a simple S-log to REC709 that's very neutral.  It is not the same sensor as FS7 but is still a nice picture and if you're generating your LUTS it's quite easy to make one to match it closely to most cams out there.  As a gimbal cam, it's very feature rich - we had one flying on a Ronin2 for a couple months on a cable, matched to FS7s and it cut quite well.  FS5 is basically the A6300 sensor with more features.

 

I have used the Ronin 1 not the M so I can't speak to the capabilities of the M.  But I can tell you that the Ronin 2 is a quantum leap forward in terms of capability and reliability.  You can't see the 2 next to the 1 and believe they're from the same company.  The 2 doesn't lose calibration and essentially every complaint I ever had with DJI products has been addressed  - the 2 is a proper bit of professional equipment.  And it's payload is 35lb, has built-in extended arms.  Point being - upgrade your stabilizer to fit more cameras instead of finding one camera to fit your stabilizer.  

 

Cameras are flavor of the day, support equipment tends to have more lifespan.  And - you can't always dictate the camera on the project, sometimes producers/outside forces dictate for you.


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#6 Robin R Probyn

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Posted 13 June 2018 - 10:09 AM

Sorry no doesn't have EI mode.. it has Slog.. but so does an A6300.. but that isnt EI mode...thats why no MLUTS..  Im not knocking it as a camera .. but if the OP is wanting to choose a camera for other work .. besides gimbal.. its very much less of a camera than the fs7 ..and would limit the shoots you could use it on.. and not really that much different from a high end DSLR/ A series ..when it comes to gimbal work..


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#7 David Daniel Doherty

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Posted 13 June 2018 - 12:56 PM

For a gimbal fs5 would be ok.. but its a very different camera from the fs7.. and could be very limiting for work if its your only pony.. 
 
Codec is only LongGOP XAVC L.. and 4K internal Rec is only 8bit..only has Picture Profiles .. no EI mode.. etc..  and there are some limitations on monitor outs.. . there is actually quite a big difference between the fs5 and fs7..  .. what about one of the high end DSLR/Mirror less cameras for the Ronin.. G4 or A7 series .. or even A9..for the gimbal.. and fs7 can handle just about anything else..


Thanks. Yeah, the specs are little disappointing, when at first FS5 appears as a lighter weight FS7.

A friend uses an A7S2 exclusively on Gimbal and a bigger camera for the rest. Ultimately I’d like best possible quality for gimbal shots though.
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#8 David Daniel Doherty

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Posted 13 June 2018 - 01:20 PM

The Ronin M is really quite small. Even the FS5 can be a pain to rig if you have a bigger lens, wireless focus, scratch audio on there.
As shown in the video above, Cine Milled plate is a must. I'd also recommend the Pan weight system as well if you're using cine style lenses (even the Samyangs) with wireless focus as you'll only just get pan balance without.
 
I've seen FS5 owners use an Atomos recorder to get better quality out. That adds a bit to the price but would give you a much better monitor to operate the gimbal with on top of better image quality.


Thanks, Atomos looks good. I ideally don’t want to further complicate my set up, but it’s an option nonetheless.
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#9 David Daniel Doherty

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Posted 13 June 2018 - 01:33 PM

Ursa mini is roughly the same size as FS7 body but heavier and less features.  What are you trying to shoot/what specs do you need the camera head to have?  It seems a bit backwards to start with a compact gimbal and buy a camera to fit it.  
 
Point being - upgrade your stabilizer to fit more cameras instead of finding one camera to fit your stabilizer.  
 
Cameras are flavor of the day, support equipment tends to have more lifespan.  And - you can't always dictate the camera on the project, sometimes producers/outside forces dictate for you.


Shooting some freelance stuff as a slide line earner to my full time job, which will be event coverage for mainstream news / media. 4K, 10bit, best poss Bel dynamic range.

Yeah a backward approach, I got a good price on the Ronin M a while back, so here I am

I hear your logic. And I’ve considered upgrading or switching gimbals. The Ronin 2 costs around 6000$£Eu I believe? Well out of my range at the minute. And the original big Ronin is too heavy. If I can find a lightweight gimbal, which was FS7 friendly, I would certainly consider doing a switcheroo.

Thanks
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#10 David Daniel Doherty

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Posted 13 June 2018 - 04:14 PM

I could nearly push my budget to a C200B. Maybe. I keep hearing its “designed as a gimbal camera” although haven’t seen it in action around the internet yet
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#11 Robin R Probyn

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Posted 13 June 2018 - 06:42 PM

Thanks. Yeah, the specs are little disappointing, when at first FS5 appears as a lighter weight FS7.

A friend uses an A7S2 exclusively on Gimbal and a bigger camera for the rest. Ultimately I’d like best possible quality for gimbal shots though.

 

 

Thats the rub.. fs5 is not a smaller fs7.. its a good B cam for the fs7/f5/f55.. but not an alternative .. and I don't believe Sony have pushed it as such.. but people have wanted to believe it is when they see the price tag :).. and some persuasive sales staff !

Have a look at the new Ronin S.. coming out soon.. less that $1K.. and supposedly can take c200/fs5/even Alexa mini .. more powerful motors than the Ronin M.. all sorts of accessories  .. I,d sell the M tomorrow .. going to plummet in price..the S will dominate pretty soon.. 


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#12 David Daniel Doherty

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Posted 15 June 2018 - 09:33 AM

Thanks for the contributions, chaps. Camera opinions and gimbal opinions.

In conclusion the FS5 is very nice on a gimbal, in the same way a 5D3 with Magic Lantern is.

I am pretty much over debating cameras now, specifications, will the camera fit on this, yes it will fit on this but you need this, it will shoot 10bit if. Unavoidable I guess, but it’s endless.

I’ll lock down a solid set up and let my work speak.

I’m about to shoot a nice project on an Fs7 though, without gimbal obviously. A little slider.

Thanks again
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#13 Robin R Probyn

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Posted 15 June 2018 - 09:25 PM

Thanks for the contributions, chaps. Camera opinions and gimbal opinions.

In conclusion the FS5 is very nice on a gimbal, in the same way a 5D3 with Magic Lantern is.

I am pretty much over debating cameras now, specifications, will the camera fit on this, yes it will fit on this but you need this, it will shoot 10bit if. Unavoidable I guess, but it’s endless.

I’ll lock down a solid set up and let my work speak.

I’m about to shoot a nice project on an Fs7 though, without gimbal obviously. A little slider.

Thanks again

 

Good luck with your shoot.. as an aside ..I just bought the Sigma T2 cine zoom set..18-35.  50-100.. relatively.. these are very inexpensive lenses .. worth checking out..


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#14 David Daniel Doherty

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Posted Yesterday, 03:02 PM

 

Good luck with your shoot.. as an aside ..I just bought the Sigma T2 cine zoom set..18-35.  50-100.. relatively.. these are very inexpensive lenses .. worth checking out..

 

 

Thanks. The shoot went well, lovely image from the FS7 and lights.

 

My setup may be overkill though. I use a slider on top of two big beast tripods, with the big FS7 on the slider.

 

Substantial bit of work moving everything from one shot to the next. And a lot of equipment to achieve some simple moves.

 

This video is to promote a product on Instagram. Set up wise, I really need to consider a more efficient way of achieving camera movement - smaller camera (maybe A7S2) and gimbal.

 

I could have captured 5 times the content with more freedom to move around the room

 

How're you finding those zooms? I have the Sigma Art 24mm, but will definitely consider zooms for future work. The may well suit my web video needs more than a few primes.

 

(Very low res screen grab attached)

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#15 Robin R Probyn

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Posted Yesterday, 08:42 PM

Yes this a common thing.. I have an f5 and Cine Zoom , often directors/producers (who have probably come from smaller camera /stills lens backgrounds or Canon C series .)  ask me for a slider.. and the only one that  works is a Dana dolly with heavy duty stands..but its a real pain to move around.. I would never use one on a 2 man crew.. you really need 3 people to move it around.. as you found out.. and then a whole load of coverage is lost due to time it takes to move it around ..whats better and alot quicker is something like a Wally Dolly.. its pretty much the most basic dolly that actually works.. alot quicker to set up than Dana dolly.. 

 

Or plan B .. often with a cam B op.. even faster.. yes something like an A7 series /5D on a small slider made for these cameras..  the new Ronin S is in my sites too.. very affordable and will be the go to gimbal Im sure..

 

Haven't used the zooms in anger yet.. I bought them for a shoot starting in a few days.. will have quite a few flights and 3 boat trips and some confined spaces..alot of hand held.. usually I would tote my Canon CN7 .. 17-120 is a very useful range.. no lens changes etc.. but the pay off is ... its damn heavy..3kg..114mm front and quite long.. usually I would use an easy rig but they are not so useful in tight locations and useless for walk and shoot ..so I went with the Sigma,s as a sort of set of primes in 2 lenses.. they are made well.. and weather sealed.. and well frankly they are also "relatively" incredibly cheap.. with relatively few draw backs.. they are pretty much par focal .. have to watch that though.. the 50-100 does breath (the 18-35 I cant really see any).. but so do some much more expensive lenses.. to a lesser degree.. I guess they are what they are.. but pro,s to con,s. they are a real steal.. basically only the breathing on a long focus pull on the 50-100 seems to be the only big draw back I can see.. they also are pleasing to the eye and hand.. also important.. got to love your gear..!.. compared to the Canon Ive been using the last 4 years.. they are positively tiny and light..but have to see how they are in the heat of battle..


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