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Dynamic Handheld - sports commercial


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#1 gregory weisert

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Posted 17 July 2018 - 06:55 AM

Hey guys,

 

I'm quite a huge fan of handheld camera. Especially when it is dynamic in a sports commercial.

 

Here is an example: 

 

As you can see the camera - when they are playing football - is very dynamic, shaky but still it is clear. With clear I mean, your eye can catch everything. It doesn't look "confused".

 

How do they get this - besides having experience and practicing a lot? Is it simple just have the camera  with an easy rig  and then doing "normal handheld" or is there more to it?

 

Really curious!

 

all the best

 

gregory


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#2 Brian Drysdale

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Posted 17 July 2018 - 07:33 AM

No special gear needed, just a well balanced camera in your hand, a small inboard monitor or VF screen, you can use the camera's  top handle if needed, then go for it. Experienced operators will get those shots, if they're willing to trade with failure for part of the time., the editor will pick the best. clips.


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#3 Robin R Probyn

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Posted 17 July 2018 - 08:04 AM

As above.. you shoot alot, a ton of footage .. and then its totally down to the editor .. I shot a similar type of thing for the steaming rights broadcaster of all the football and base ball in Japan .. after 16 x 10hr plus days of shooting.. 2 x 30 sec clips were cut out of 100,s of hours of footage..well alot of footage ! percentage game.. you shoot alot and by the law of averages you will capture some great shots.. some skill of the camera op, some luck and a very good editor..


Edited by Robin R Probyn, 17 July 2018 - 08:08 AM.

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#4 gregory weisert

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Posted 17 July 2018 - 08:06 AM

Focus puller might be also very important in this one, isn't it?

 

The thing is when I try to operate like this, I can often notice vibration or motion errors on the vertical from walking or running with the camera. How you handle this?

 

all the best

gregory


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#5 Robin R Probyn

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Posted 17 July 2018 - 08:16 AM

Focus puller might be also very important in this one, isn't it?

 

The thing is when I try to operate like this, I can often notice vibration or motion errors on the vertical from walking or running with the camera. How you handle this?

 

all the best

gregory

 

Well for me anyway.. there was no focus puller.. he/she would have no chance really.. running along  holding the camera low by the  handle following a ball.. just go wide.. have some sort of decent DoF.. set focus to 3-4ft.. and run like hell ;)..  if you have Movi and all that stuff you could have a remote FP .. but its a different look.. and the cuts are so quick anyway .. like 1 or 2 seconds only.. they want that movement .. if the shots are longer over crank a bit helps..


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#6 Robin R Probyn

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Posted 17 July 2018 - 08:21 AM

BTW easy rig is useless for running shots.. and not designed for it either.. sways madly side to side.. 


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#7 gregory weisert

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Posted 17 July 2018 - 08:25 AM

 

Well for me anyway.. there was no focus puller.. he/she would have no chance really.. running along  holding the camera low by the  handle following a ball.. just go wide.. have some sort of decent DoF.. set focus to 3-4ft.. and run like hell ;)..  if you have Movi and all that stuff you could have a remote FP .. but its a different look.. and the cuts are so quick anyway .. like 1 or 2 seconds only.. they want that movement .. if the shots are longer over crank a bit helps..

 

oh wow no focus puller.. I thought that was also the secret to get these shots in focus. 

Yeah MoVi would be different and I'm not a big fan of it.

It is exactly that type of handheld look I like - the one in the video.

 

I thought the Flowcine Sirene will help with that and avoids the swinging side2side..


Edited by gregory weisert, 17 July 2018 - 08:26 AM.

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#8 Robin R Probyn

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Posted 17 July 2018 - 09:27 AM

Also looking back at that video.. the shots are all pretty wide..they might have had a FP I dont know.. but I feel for that type of basically documentary type shooting you are choosing your focus totally on the fly .. and without thinking about it much.. just intuitively .. and a FP wouldn't be able to mind read you..  

 

The flowcine Serene is for gimbals big enemy.. the 4th axis ..up and down movement.. but it wont help the side to side.. flowcine does have an attachment for that .. The Gravity One.. buts a pretty big bit of gear and wouldn't be practical for that sort of handheld shooting IMHO..

 

TBH I really think its the editor who will totally make or break these type of shoots.. a good editor will make all those shots that really look like quite crappy in rushes !!.. into something great..


Edited by Robin R Probyn, 17 July 2018 - 09:39 AM.

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#9 Jaron Berman

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Posted 22 July 2018 - 05:51 PM

Brian is correct.  Don't overthink the technicality or downplay the skill of people who do these things well.  Ops who shoot handheld doc-style every day hours on end tend to be pretty good at shooting doc-style smoothly.  Balance is key, practice is key.

 

There is only one trick involved in this type of thing and everyone has touched on it one way or another.  It doesn't look "confused" because your eye knows where to look.  Between the operating and the editing, your eye is drawn where they want it to be drawn.  That's the trick.  Your brain will stabilize shots for your eyes when you WANT to focus on something.  If you're following the ball and clearly the ball is the focus then you're not aware of how the edges of the frame are moving.  If 90% of the frame is one guy and you can follow him as he and the camera move - you're not paying much attention to the nuance of how the frame edges are moving.  Part of that is because you brain is concentrating on the info you've been given and part of it is that the editors have chosen EXACTLY what information to give you.

 

There is a misconception that handheld is "sloppy."  Doesn't have to be.  Good operating and editing go a long way.  


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#10 Macks Fiiod

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Posted 30 July 2018 - 10:19 PM

 

oh wow no focus puller.. I thought that was also the secret to get these shots in focus. 

Yeah I remember doing something similar to run and gun tracking with an F900.

 

I slapped a wide 17mm on it and with the sensor so tiny, practically everything was in focus regardless.

Pulling the lens to focus primarily on the closest distance will work in your favor, naturally we expect what's closest to be the easiest to make out.


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#11 Daniel Lo Presti

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 06:45 AM

Would I be wrong in assuming a global shutter might help a lot here?

 

I recognise the "confused" description and I usually associate that look with a rolling shutter, particularly shooting handheld on a small, light camera.

 

And possibly also shooting at a larger shutter angle could help, although pausing on some fast action in that video doesn't seem to reveal any particularly excessive motion blur.


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#12 Brian Drysdale

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 06:53 AM

It depends on the amount of the rolling shutter artifact the camera displays, higher end cameras tend to have less of this, it wouldn't be as noticeable.

 

The shutter speed would depend on the level of the "Saving Private Ryan" effect you want.


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#13 Robin R Probyn

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 06:45 PM

Alot of that type of shooting has been done on Arri,s and none of them have global shutter.. only the F55 that I can think of actually .. its only really down in the DSLR league that rolling shutter is a major problem..  


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#14 Stuart Brereton

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 07:39 PM

There's little or no rolling shutter evident in that video because the operator is following the action in a considered way, rather than just frantically hosing the camera around. Good handheld work tells a story. it's not needlessly shaky or wildly moving around.


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