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Vision 2 5218


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#1 vikash nowlakha

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Posted 08 September 2005 - 10:33 AM

In past experiences found 18 to be a 'soft' stock. Really gentle on faces, incredible detail into the blacks. Low saturation and contrast. Have a situation though where i'd like to take the same stock into an edgier - snappier space - is that possible ? Dont have the opportunity to do a DI or a bleach bypass. All needs to be done either in camera or lighting. Need rich blacks, burning hilights - really low key noir space with really high lighting contrast ! Would you just see too much using 18. Would the blacks be tight, sharp and crisp. What lighting ratio would you go with. Also how do you think tobacco or an antique suede filtration would affect those blacks.
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#2 John Pytlak RIP

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Posted 08 September 2005 - 12:12 PM

In past experiences found 18 to be a 'soft' stock. Really gentle on faces, incredible detail into the blacks. Low saturation and contrast. Have a situation though where i'd like to take the same stock into an edgier - snappier space - is that possible ? Dont have the opportunity to do a DI or a bleach bypass. All needs to be done either in camera or lighting. Need rich blacks, burning hilights - really low key noir space with really high lighting contrast ! Would you just see too much using 18. Would the blacks be tight, sharp and crisp. What lighting ratio would you go with. Also how do you think tobacco or an antique suede filtration would affect those blacks.
cheers

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


For "rich" (high density) blacks with lots of shadow detail, avoid underexposure. Slight overexposure with higher lighting contrast will likely give you the "snappier space" you seek. For rich, neutral blacks, you don't usually want filtration. Keep light out of the deep shadows if you don't want to show detail there.
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#3 Brad Grimmett

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Posted 08 September 2005 - 02:15 PM

Don't you think you'd be better suited using a different stock? A stock that is more suited towards your needs? It seems like you want to use a stock for the exact opposite purposes it's designed for. Unless you have a bunch of 18 lying around, why don't you just buy a different stock?
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#4 vikash nowlakha

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Posted 08 September 2005 - 03:18 PM

The only 500 ASA stock available to me is the 18 from the vision 2 series. My other options are only 17 and 05 also from the vision 2 series. And thats an area I dont want to get into as the locations are cramped and I dont want to use big lights. I also am using a lot of gels on lights that would cut at least a stop.
I do however like the grain structure of the 18 stock - compared to the old 79. I realize that the vision 2 series seems really designed for DI -(John ?) - softer curves down the bottom and more overall detail. But could you use those same things to give you a grittier (not mistaken with granier) image.
My association with 18 is really the look of lemony snicket - yeah that's an extreme - and really soft light wrapping around. Everything like a painting. Beautifull beautifull film ! What if you utilize the same latitude and light for the extreme ends. 3/4 Key at 2 1/2 stops over camera stop and (dont) fill 3 stops under key. How would the stock handle that. v/s very little light just at the right angles and spots very delicately put. Very controlled. Just drifting into the blacks.
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#5 John Pytlak RIP

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Posted 08 September 2005 - 03:31 PM

The only 500 ASA stock available to me  is the 18 from the vision 2 series. My other options are only 17 and 05 also from the vision 2 series. And thats an area I dont want to get into as the locations are cramped and I dont want to use big lights. I also am using a lot of gels on lights that would cut at least a stop.
I do however like the grain structure of the 18 stock - compared to the old 79.  I realize that the vision 2 series seems really designed for DI -(John ?) -  softer curves down the bottom and more overall detail. But could you use those same things to give you a grittier (not mistaken with granier) image. 
My association with 18 is really the look of lemony snicket - yeah that's an extreme - and really soft light wrapping around. Everything like a painting. Beautifull beautifull film !  What if you utilize the same latitude and light for the extreme ends.  3/4 Key at 2 1/2 stops over camera stop and (dont) fill 3 stops under  key. How would the stock handle that. v/s very little light just at the right angles and spots very delicately put. Very controlled. Just drifting into the blacks.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


As I said, 5218 can be lit to give a harsher look. Overexposure will give really rich blacks. Holding light out of the shadows will keep them void of detail. High lighting contrast will push the highlights toward white, and give a harder "look".
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#6 Joe Ornelas

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Posted 08 September 2005 - 07:30 PM

Don't be afraid of 7205. You wont need huge lights. It is a slower stock, but who cares. If you know what you are doing, then it shouldnt be a problem. If you want super rich colors, shoot 200T or 100T. Your blacks will be black and rich. Move away from 7218, any DP with two eyepatches can shoot 7218 and get an exposure. Challenge yourself and I think you will get some awesome results.
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#7 John Hyde

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Posted 08 September 2005 - 07:53 PM

The suggestions above are just what you need. Over expose slightly and let the lighting go a bit hard and moody. Good contrast will help get the look you are after.

Without your colorist being on the same page you may have a soft, bland picture in any case. Your colorist should also be able to stretch the signal and play with contours to help make the picture even more snappy/sharp. Lightly blowing out the highlights and crushing the blacks should work wonders if he has a good piece of film to work with. Be sure to keep him well imformed as to the look you are after.

Good luck!
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Opal

Rig Wheels Passport

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rebotnix Technologies

Paralinx LLC

Wooden Camera

CineLab

FJS International, LLC

Glidecam

Media Blackout - Custom Cables and AKS

The Slider

Ritter Battery